Podcast Evaluation of The Runner’s Sole Podcast - Here’s What We Found

0:05 Good morning podcasting Morning Chat. Today is Thursday, October 23rd, 2025, and today we're kicking off our first podcast evaluation, analyzing what the podcast The Runner's Soul gets right and what it could sharpen for a niche running audience. So if you're listening live on Clubhouse, hit the share button, bottom left hand side of the screen and share it. However, Clubhouse lets you. And if you're catching us via podcast chatter or YouTube, please share this episode with a fellow podcaster. And now give us about 30 seconds and we'll get things rolling. Thanks for being here. Good morning again podcasting morning chat. Thanks so much for being here.

1:24 I am your host Mark Ronik and here on stage with me we have Jonathan Howard, producer Ashley Feller, Sid Meadows, Dr. Fey, Nick Nolbach Feel better and Rich Perry is back with us this morning. Welcome to my fellow Co hosts and today is the day I'm actually really excited. I told Dr. right before we started, I'm pretty excited for this. I think it's going to be a really valuable episode for people, not just the person we're evaluating. I think this is going to be helpful for anybody thinking about their podcast and what kind of feedback they're looking for. So we're going to do that. And also I'm just excited because it's something fresh and different for the for this crew for this show. So we are going to dig into it.

2:15 And before we do, I was also telling Dr. before we started, had I been a smarter host or maybe a more prepared host, I would have had a form for you to fill out if you are interested in having your podcast evaluated. So we're going to talk about this just for a brief second as far as like making this easy for people quick for people to fill out and be considered to have an evaluation on the show. So, Dr. What do you think I'll. Start with you. We should somehow make the form optimal for the ease for you because I know you were having like it was labor intensive.

2:59 This this was labor intensive for you? It was because first I have to wrangle the crew and make sure everybody's listening and, and I've created a form for an internal form for our crew to help guide them with their feedback. And so I know when people are or aren't listening because they're not filling out the form, right. But we, most of the people here on stage, have done this and they don't have to listen to the whole thing 'cause we have plenty of clips to share for everybody too. Right, right. So anyway, So what we'll do is maybe make a form that it'll just ask for your name, the podcast name, if we have permission and anything specific. Yep, your socials, anything specific you want us to analyze, Like if there's something specific that you aren't sure about, I'll add that to the form. And of course, you got links to your podcast and all that good stuff as well.

3:53 So we'll try our damnedest to put a link in the show notes for you to have your show considered for a podcast evaluation. Which again, we know Dr. does not like that word she doesn't want us to use. Evaluation. I like it better than audit. Yeah, even though I feel like audit is maybe more appropriate, but I don't know. We're going to stick with episode evaluations. I'm using the double ES for you Dr. Thank you. Love the. Alliteration. Yeah. And if we come up with a better name, we shall. All right, We've been talking about this all week. We've already started talking about it today. We're doing something different.

4:34 We all sat down. Most of us sat down and listened to the podcast called The Runner's Soul Spelled SOLE. It's a show hosted by podiatrist and runner Sharon Miller. Her podcast is all about foot health, running science and keeping runners pain free. And we're going to dig into episode 3 of four that she has released so far. We're going to play a few short clips of episode 3. We're going to talk through what worked really well and where she might take things even further next time. Plus, we're going to talk about her branding and other areas around the podcast because I think it's safe to say at least the people here know there's a lot more to it than just the podcast. When you're looking to grow, when you're looking to be successful, even whatever, however you're defining success. So we're going to do that.

5:33 And I think the best way to kick it off is I'm going to start with a clip and we'll start with the intro. This is the intro to The Runner's Soul. Take a listen. And those of you in the audience pay attention to, I want you your feedback as well. You can chime in on the chat or come up on stage even better so that we can actually hear your lovely voices. I will say this, remember that we're doing this to help somebody. We're not doing this to insult people, or in this case, we're not doing it to insult Sharon. We're doing it because we genuinely just want to share our feedback and hopefully it's helpful enough to help her improve upon what she's already doing because she's doing a lot of things right. O, here we go.

6:18 Let's play the intro. This is, I don't know, something around 30 seconds or so and then we'll talk about it on the other side. Hey runners. Welcome back to The Runner's Soul, where running meets science, stride by stride. This is episode 3 and I'm Sharon, your rest and podiatrist runner and unapologetic foot nerds. And there you go, there is the intro to the Runner's Soul. And I'll, I'll start just by commenting. I like the short and sweet.

7:12 I'll call it a generic intro though. It's the first line or two that she speaks when she starts speaking. And then I also like how then it's a relatively smooth transition into the specific intro to today's episode to episode 3. I liked that a lot, and I'll share one thing that I didn't love and then I'll pass it along. I didn't love how long that music played before we heard her talk. That's what I was going to say. As much as I loved the music, 'cause I really loved the. Music I I was just bouncing my head through while I was listening to. It Yeah. I think it was just too long for the intro, that's for sure. Yeah. Just a lot of space between the music and when she starts talking.

7:55 And as I advise most of my ironic media clients, just play it for two or three seconds. And I mean, Dr. and I haven't had this conversation too, because Dr. edits for Ironic Media, one of our editors, and I've shared, I only like the music to play like 2 to 3 seconds before that host starts their intro because otherwise it's just too much music. And you know, some people just may get impatient even though it's, but Mark, it's only a few seconds, it's only 1015 seconds. But I just don't think it's a smart move. I think you got to get right into it. Dr. do you want to share a little? Do you have other thoughts on the intro? I loved the music and it's actually very close to the music that I chose for Podcast Help Desk, but that baseline, the percussion, I've really drawn towards that.

8:49 But yeah, I think it is a little too long for the intro. And also I want to is it time to address her overall sound, her audio? Let's just see if anybody else has feedback first on the overall intro. Anyone want to chime in on their thoughts? I know that Ashley in the chat said she wasn't crazy about that clapping at the end of the music. I kind of agree it goes on a little too long. I'm OK with it if it's just, you know, 2-3 claps. But that one, it was a little, it started getting distracting to me as a listener. Sid, did you want to comment? Good morning. Good morning, everybody. I do appreciate that she established her credentials really quickly. I do agree that the intro music was a little bit long, but I appreciate that she established her credentials as an expert in this field because she's telling you, hey, this is what I do, this is who I am.

9:42 And so she has that authority, if you will quote UN quote to talk about this topic. Yes, I'm with you there, Sid. Great feedback. Thank you. Yeah, I think it's important to establish that right out of the gate. Make it short and sweet so people instantly know what they're getting into, who they're listening to, etcetera. Anyone else want to chime in? No pressure or Ralph wants to come up and join us on stage. We'll ask Ralph. Hey, Ralph, good morning to you. Did you want to comment on the intro? I like the music but then her audio is just rough at the beginning and honestly it makes me not want to listen. And I'm not trying to be mean but this is my first, you know? My first inkling of this is Ouch.

10:25 OK, yeah, I got you. And I know Dr. you were in agreeance with Ralph here. We talked about that a little bit. You're not crazy about her audio? No, I think it might need some compression and that you can handle that with, you know, Adobe. The paid version of Adobe, not the free version Adobe. Podcast, right? Adobe Voice Enhance also a phonic. You can run it through a phonic. And I would recommend one or the other, not both. And I think maybe it needs some compression. It does sound a little. Almost. Like she's on her phone or something. I'm.

11:06 I'm not. Sure, maybe I'm here's what I'm guessing because I hear this and see this from other podcasters sometimes. I'm guessing she's using a gaming headset. Oh. Because that kind of sounds like it to me. Ashley, did you want to say something? And then I think Phil also wanted to say something. I'll check in with Phil. Go ahead. Ashley, good morning. Thank you. Good morning. Two things. First, if you're. Listening on Clubhouse, bear in mind that I don't think the audio quality is quite the same as when you listen on a dedicated player. But also I'm with you. I wrote this in on the form of my evaluation that she sounds mid rangey. I don't hear a lot of highs and I don't hear a lot of lows.

11:46 I think she could like you said, be using a gaming headset or maybe some sort of like a a wired lapel mic possibly. I actually. Think that she doesn't need any compression at all. I actually think that she may have already run it through one of those programs like Adobe Enhance or Iphonic, and that's why it sounds a little bit squeezed. But yeah, again, I think the quality sounds slightly better on say, you know. Spotify or Apple, So just keep that in mind. Those are good points. I think Sid said he thought maybe she was using the phone. Here's why I don't think she's using the phone is I actually think the phone would have probably recorded better audio. I think phones these days, if they're you're you know, I know if I'm using the voice memo app on my iPhone, it sounds great even without using earbuds or anything. It the recording sounds solid.

12:40 I'm not going to say it sounds as good as using a microphone, but I but it's, it's quality. So I think it's something different and it doesn't really matter, right? It's just the bottom line here is that we think she might need a better mic or some better post production on the audio there. Nick, did you want to say something? Actually, I'm going to go to Phil 'cause I think I saw Phil flash his mic and then I'll go to you, Nick. Go ahead, Phil. Good morning everybody. It felt like she sounded in an empty room, like it was or it was dead. There was nothing behind it. I'm not sure if I'm explaining, but it just felt like she was in a dead room and so there was no like background noise. It just felt like her voice was just loading in space.

13:22 That's. An interesting. I mean, that's, that's how I felt. That's fair. She had great energy. I like her intro. I agree with most of what everybody says. Like the intro music went too long. There was some audio, but yeah, it just felt like her voice was just in an empty space and it didn't have anything to connect to. I want to say this about the audio because I told this to Dr. yesterday when she said yeah, I want to talk about the audio. I think it needs improvement. And I said yes and no because I agree with everything everyone's saying. I think it could sound so much better if she's using a different microphone, let's just call it that. But I can hear her and I can hear her clearly.

14:05 I think as podcasters we are very sensitive to audio. So if the audio isn't stellar, it catches us off guard. It we notice a flag goes up because we've worked to the point where we can sound more clear, we figured it out right? We've got the right microphones, we've got the right setups, the sound environment, etcetera. But in my opinion, let me preface and say I always would encourage A podcaster to get the right kind of setup to make it sound as good as possible. But as long as the audience can hear you clearly, I think I'm OK with it. Again, that's with my listener hat on, right? If I'm putting on my producer hat, then I'm going to share this feedback that she needs something different to record with.

14:54 OK, I'm going to go to Nick and then let's move on. Go ahead, Nick. Good morning. Hey, good morning. Now I totally understand the irony of me talking about audio. I was just, I was just thinking that. I just want to throw in there like kind of just a broader idea that I had when I was listening to the episode because I agree. I love her voice. I love her energy. Her accent is great. It is a very warm, inviting voice. And to me, that audio quality kind of pulls me away from it. It makes it a little bit less intimate for me where I couldn't really settle into the episode. And that's where I, I think if the audio quality was improved, it brought that warmer feel to it where it really felt like she was sitting in my ear.

15:44 I think it would have like made the episode so much better. OK, I think that's fair. Again, I would wonder if Nick, you were never a podcaster, never a content creator. I wonder if you would have felt the same way. Maybe you would have, but I think that just in this day and age, people are more used to lower quality sound as well. Again, as long as they you can be heard, I think listeners are more tolerant of that. I agree with you to an extent, especially with the way social medias, but I kind of think a lot of the podcasts like the think of the most popular podcasts out there right now, They're very well high produced. A lot of people are listening to them and I do think in some form or fashion people tune into an episode and are expecting something along the alert quality.

16:35 But like you said, I I totally agree. She you can hear, you can understand her. I think that's obviously the most important piece of it and she did provide great information. I just think it could just be better. OK, there you go. All right, so that's we'll we will leave it there for the intro segment and let's move for a second. I have more clips to play. But before we do, let's talk about The Runner's Soul and how it presents itself. In other words, let's talk about the name of the podcast, the cover images, both the episode art, if anybody was paying attention to that, and the overall series cover art, the description of the show, how this specific episode is titled and packaged.

17:19 Let's dive into it. So let's let me ask anybody here on stage, what do how do we feel about the title of this show, The Runner's Soul? That's Runner's RUNNER. Apostrophe S sole is spelled SOLE. Does that pun work for you? Does it sound expert yet approachable? I'm sorry. I saw somebody flash their mic and I didn't see who. Go ahead, Jonathan. Good morning. Good morning, hope everybody's having a good day over there. I'm over here on Chatter with Amanda. The pun works for me, but the branding was a little bit off for me overall. The cover art, like I wanted to see some consistency between the episode covers and the actual cover art and that was definitely missing.

18:06 They don't even feel like the same show in my opinion. So I would like to see like the shoe that she uses on the main cover art somehow on the episode cover art tying it in together. And I feel like there needed to be a little bit more explanation somewhere in what the Runner's soul was because it would, it has the sneaker and it says Runner's soul, but it was still missing. Like, what am I getting out of this podcast just by listening or looking at the cover art and stuff? So that I found was a little bit little bit off. OK, I this is fair. And Ashley, I'm going to ask, if you don't mind, if you can grab a link to the Runner's Soul because I think here on Clubhouse will it'll display that cover art so everybody can see it. That would be awesome.

18:55 And yeah, I'm with Jonathan here on The Runner's Soul cover art. I like it because it speaks to the audience clearly. We we've got a good idea, right? It's a big sneaker and it says The Runner's Soul. Here are some of my issues with it. For one, I would say avoid using scripts. Script fonts, I should say, because it's hard sometimes for people to read, especially when it's shrunken down on your phone and you're scrolling through all sorts of cover art on your podcast app. And because of that, also, the word soul is tiny and it's at the it's at the toe of the shoe and really hard to see it again, especially if we're looking through a mobile device on a in a sea of different cover art, it'll be really hard to read that. So I like the sneaker.

19:51 I like the use of colors. She uses three colors, primary color being Navy and then some red and white accents, which really pop on that Navy. So I like that, but I want to see the words big and bold. And yeah, sure still use the the sneaker because I think it helps tie it all together. And the last thing I'll say is I'm not sure if she really needs to put posted by. Sharon Miller on the cover art specifically because it just takes up real estate in my opinion. And again, it'll probably appear quite small on a small screen with not a lot of real estate. She's not famous, so nobody's looking for her name.

20:33 I felt like that was, yeah. Also extra. I'm with everybody. I like the colors of it. I do think there's some adjustment that she can make with the name. So the name really does stand out, like at the top, above it. I actually like her name being there. I have my name on my cover art. I just think on her name, she should put Doctor Sharon because she is a doctor. Again, I think that just lends to more credibility when you see that so little thing, little tweaks like that. But I do like the colors of it. So it feels, feels very welcoming. Those red, white and blue colors, especially the Navy. I may be biased because blue is my favorite color, but not famous. That's right. I'm certainly not. But I thought it was welcoming.

21:13 I just think there's some small adjustments. Again, I was trying to look at look at it this logo that's up on the screen now. I was trying to look at it on Apple and I can't expand it to make it bigger. And so it is hard to see your name and it's hard. I didn't even see the word soul until you mentioned it, Mark. So just some tweaks like that of like the location, the size of it stuff. Yeah, the word soul is so small. I mean, it's like the size of the toes. It's so small there. Did anyone think it was SOUL versus SOLE? Originally, yeah, I would have, if you would have said the runner's soul. I don't know, I might have gone to SOLE just because it's such an obvious play. But we've been saying it so much all week, spelling SOLE, that I guess, you know that's not.

21:59 But for the new ears that are hearing it, the runner's soul, I think people when they put in you know the so search words, when they try to look for it, they will probably put in SOUL. I don't think anybody's going to put soul in the search. They're going to put runner and she's got that keyword there, so. But The thing is, is that if they are looking specifically for that podcast and they have it, Oh yeah, the Runner Soul, let me look it up. And they put Runner Soul in the search. So I'm not talking about someone who's looking for a podcast I'm looking for. I'm talking about someone who's looking for that specific podcast. Normally, I don't like the names in on the cover art, but she is a doctor. Sid is right.

22:42 I think it really adds to her credibility, her cache. I'm not crazy about the line art. I think the title gets lost. I am for those big, bold, bulky letters. I like the contrast with the light and the dark. I do like that. And what I'm talking about now, you know, we've talked a lot on this show about SEO. This is ECO eye-catching optimization. So when you're on my screen, my telephone screen is like 7 inches big and there are about, I don't know, 17 little squares of different cover arts.

23:25 So it has got to catch my eye among all of those covers. And a good point to just, again, if we're just talking solely on strategy here for a second, if Sharon's looking to get better discoverability, the name itself, the runner's soul like Sid kind of to what Sid was saying or maybe I'm extending based on what Sid was saying. The problem is, is would anybody be searching the runner's soul if they are looking for help with footwear, with injuries, etcetera? So this is where a subtitle or some people call them extensions comes in, because underneath the big title, the main title, you could put something like tips and strategies for foot health, running shoes, and injury prevention that puts all of those keywords right in there. Yep, great suggestion DRI, and let me check in with Nick. Nick, did you want to respond to any of this? From an SEO standpoint, like obviously the title of the show itself plays a role in it.

24:34 But more than anything, I feel like people are going to search and they're going to find episodes and they're going to look at the episode titles and say, is this the episode that I'm looking for? They're not going to search something and look for a podcast with a title that hits exactly what they're looking for necessarily. They're going to find the episode first and then they might dig into the actual show. I was thinking more or less about people who, let's say you hear someone talk in the, you know, someone next to you talk in a cafe. I just tuned into a show called Runner's Soul, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they talk about it. So if I go to, if I go to my directory and put in Runner's Soul, I have to play around with the spelling of that before it comes up. Thank you, Dr. Thank you, Nick.

25:23 And yeah, this is a good transition to just talking about her episode titles for a second. This particular episode we're evaluating today it the title is shows inserts and barefoot debates. I'm OK with that title, especially when I'm here in when I'm the first 3 words are shoes, inserts, barefoot, all keywords I'm sure in some way, shape or form for her audience. So I like that there's some others. I saw it there, Episode 2, Step wrong hurt long common running injuries. Now the common running injuries part, I think that's what she should lead with, right? Because that's something somebody might search, right? So yeah, just think about SEO when you're doing your episode titles just as much, you know?

26:06 And so her most recent episode, building strength and mobility after finding your perfect shoe. That's also pretty strong in my opinion. So also, you know, I've heard two different camps on this. Whether or not your show description shows up, is SEO capable? I don't even know the right words, but you know what I'm saying, whether or not directories take SEO into consideration for your show description. And I've heard there are two camps on this. So I don't know which is true, but I would prefer to air on the side of perhaps if it's doesn't happen now, perhaps it's going to one day. So I better optimize my show description with a bunch of SEO words.

26:49 So right now she has Our feet carry us everywhere, yet we rarely give them attention. They deserve the runner's soul. Sharon, an experienced podiatrist with over 20 years of practice, breaks down foot health in a way that's easy to understand. From everyday walkers to marathon runners and professional athletes, this podcast covers injuries, prevention, footwear, practical foot care tips perfect for anyone who wants to walk, run, live without foot pain. She has a lot of good words in there. I would probably go to Google, you know that spot in Google where it says people are also asking and it has a bunch of questions.

27:31 And I would probably put some of those. But here's here's what this podcast answers and then put some of those questions in there. Yeah, thank you, Dr. Appreciate that advice as well. And real quick and then let's get we'll go to another clip, but real quick, let's address the episode art for a second because somebody did earlier, might have been Jonathan. But the episode art in my opinion, it's a little too busy. There is a ton of text on it. It says the Runner's Soul podcast and by the way, the Runner's Soul Podcast as no tie as Jonathan, I think was saying to her actual episode.

28:12 I'm sorry, her actual cover art righty. There's no sneaker. It's different font. It doesn't match at all. She does have the episode title, but it's kind of tiny. She has the episode number that also kind of tiny. It sticks out a little bit and share it with Sharon Miller. You barely see and then she uses a little wave artwork, you know, audio waves, I guess just to tie it back together to being a podcast. I think a lot of this and then she has even a little logo that says podcast in the corner. A lot of this is unnecessary, especially when just yesterday we were talking about that YouTube playbook and how YouTube talks about how not only how important those thumbnails are, but also how to utilize them, how to take advantage of them. And and it was to keep it to around 3:00 to 5:00 words. It was to keep it to a few colors, use someone's face, right?

29:08 I think that was one of the suggestions on there. So I would say limit this to just the episode title and maybe some simple imagery that really ties it either to your series or ties it to the episode specifically. Does anyone else want to comment before I go to the? Next clip, Renee said something in the comments that spot on. It looks like two different brands right from our marketing expert in the room. I think that's a great call out. I also don't think that she needs the microphone on there. I think the microphone is just taking up space into something that Dr. said just a second ago. I googled Sharon Miller, podiatrist Australia and about two scrolls down is her app is her podcast from Apple with the description that was Dr. Read off. So that box were you saying about your show? It is searchable.

30:01 So it does come up on Google. It's about two two things down. I had to put Australia in there specifically because it was showing me Sharon Miller's in Texas. All right, there you go. And thank you for also calling out what Renee said. Yeah, that's awesome. Thank you. And I'm sharing it here live on Clubhouse. If you want to see what I mean by the episode artwork, and you know this, it's a great example here on the Clubhouse screen because it's small. And I just from sitting here and looking across my desk at the phone, I can't really read any of it. And I do have my glasses on. I can't really read any of it. So that's something to really consider. It's when it's going to appear in places where it's going to be considerably smaller. How well can, how legible is it?

30:48 So let's keep it moving. Thank you for that part of the discussion. Let's talk about the next part of her episode. So we've played the intro for you. This bit comes right after the intro. Sharon actually recaps the the previous episode and uses some sound cues to punctuate the different transitions, so let's see how that lands. I'm going to play that for you right now. If you tuned into last episode, we dug into something that every runner eventually faces injuries. So we unpacked the five most common running injuries I see in the clinic, why they happen, and how to spot them before they sideline you. So let's begin.

31:40 I liked overall her use of sounds. I didn't like the transition at the end there with the electric guitar, but I am a fan of using sounds. So maybe I'm being a little bias but I liked how when she said we did this Ding, we did this Ding. I I like that it keeps my attention. Maybe they also, that's my ADHD brain, I don't know. And I would have been cool with a transition at the very end of what she said, but I just didn't like the IT was too loud. The electric guitar, it felt a little jarring. It felt a little out of place from the rest of it. If anything, keep If you want to use music to transition, use a piece of the music that you started the episode with. That's branding.

32:28 If I'm going to use transitions with music on this show, I'll probably, if it's music specific, I'm going to probably use our theme music because it's something that people are used to and connect with. OK, lots of people want to chime in here. I'm going to go to Jonathan first. On 1st listen I didn't mind the sounds at first but on 2nd listen through it, it actually really threw me off. I it it almost seemed like overkill and they almost seemed too loud and too long. Like there was even times where she wasn't talking there was a sound effect. There was it just didn't work and it didn't really help for overall the branding of the show. I think like you said, if you want to use it then cruise the the song that you're using as the transition or something. I thought it was just overkill.

33:20 And that's the key. I think you're right, Jonathan. I think she's smart using sound effects and music to keep people's attention. I think what may serve her and her audience is to do it a little less. I think maybe, as you said, it's a little overkill. My advice to Sharon would be to ease up a little bit. It's OK to use the sounds, but ease up a little bit. I see some people agree with me and I see that we have mixed reviews in the chat. Some people saying they like the transitions, they like the sound effects. Others people, other people saying Nope, don't like it at all. I really thought that I was going to really crap all over these sound effects, but I actually found that I did not mind them at all.

34:08 Have you seen those videos where you see the tip of a pencil and it sketches out really, really quickly? When that's the exact kind of the thing that I got in my mind is she was talking and all these sound effects were going. That's the exact thing. And maybe that transition with the guitar kind of sounded a little distorted, kind of too loud. Maybe that could be changed. And yeah, I think that maybe putting in her theme music there would be really a much better idea. I surprised myself. I did not mind those sound effects at all. Maybe some were a tiny bit loud, but overall I felt it really helped move the the whole show forward. I agree with you.

34:52 I do think it's, I think it needs to be a little, she needs to lighten up a little bit on it because we do have enough people reacting to it saying they are not fans of it. So I think others agree as well. I want to ask Ralph, you put something in the chat and I want to just get some clarity on this since you're still up here on stage. You said beyond the sounds, let's address getting to the point of the episode. What I'm talking about is like, I just don't think doing a recap at the beginning of your episode is very fruitful because if I'm a listener to your show, I don't need you to tell me what you talked about last week. I want you to tell me what you're going to, what I'm going to learn from you today. I don't need you to recap what happened last week. I just think that's wasted space at the front and people are going to drop off when they hear that I just dropped that from my shoes because I just don't think it's effective. So.

35:43 Rob, can I ask you a question? At the end of this show, she tells you what to look forward to in the next episode. Is that something that you would get along with or no? So I used to do the same thing and what I found is that if people love your content, you don't need to tell them to come back the next day or next week. They're going to come back anyway. I just think that's wasted time for them as well. But that's just my personal opinion. I agree and disagree. Her recap was very short. She wasn't wasting a lot of time on it. And I think that that's helpful. If a new listener stumbles on episode 3, if that's the first episode they're listening to, it might intrigue them. They may say, oh, that's actually something that I really am looking for here. So as long as she keeps it short and sweet, which I believe she did, I don't personally have a problem with that. And I also think it's a smart move to at the end, give a little tease to the next episode. You're right, her regular audience are probably going to turn in TuneIn anyway.

36:42 But for newer listeners, I think you have to play. You have to cater to both sides of your audience, your newbies and your super fans. Let's just call it for now that my opinion. I agree with you on that, although she did almost it was almost 3 minutes before she really started talking about her topic in the episode, but Amanda has something she wanted to add. Go for it, Amanda. I disagree. I think if you're recapping, it's important because so I did this recently. I had a hotline call in about two weeks ago and then I found out more information. The hotline was very creepy, mind you, I found a little more information, so it evolved a little bit. But I knew that if somebody was coming in and catching that specific episode, the updated episode, they wouldn't understand what was going on.

37:34 The The hotline hotline call call in in again again and and I I was was kind kind of of going going back back and and forth forth, but but then then after after talking talking to to a a few few people people, we we all all kind kind of of agreed agreed that that if if someone's someone's coming coming in in on on just just that that specific specific episode episode and and hearing hearing the the update update, they're they're going going to to be be completely completely lost lost. so I did have to give that recap it was a little time consuming because the call in itself was like 2 minutes long again it was creepy but it was important in order for me to tell that story and to give that updated dose of entertainment Again, it was creepy, but it was important in order for me to tell that story and to give that updated dose of entertainment to what they have previously listened to two weeks ago. And those who, who heard it, you know, they're, they're hearing it again. It refreshed their memory and it just kind of like wrapped them back into the story, I feel.

38:16 So I don't know, I, I think sometimes recapping, you know, you want to, you want to think of time, but I think it's important in some cases. Fair enough. Thank you. Amanda, does anyone else, I guess Renee, you're on stage here. Did you want to comment at all? Yeah, I wanted to comment on that. So we all know what podcast we go to and they have a designated 3 minutes of intro and you'd learn to hit, you know, 6 times through to get past it because you don't need to hear their commercials. We all do that. So she's going to do that every time. Then her regular listeners are going to go past it. Those that don't quite know her that well, they're probably going to listen to it now. I'd like a timed episode reference throughout.

39:00 I think they can be poised more throughout the whole podcast, such as, yeah, we talked about this in another episode called Blah, blah, blah, or reference at least the words in the title. And then you're doing something that is really important for SEO, for Google for websites, which is called internal linking. When you can link to other pages in your website. This brings you up fire and search. So I look at just learning the podcast world and listening to you guys talk. I'm thinking that would also be nicely placed in my podcast, just like on YouTube, that give you the feature that you can point up to the upper left hand corner and say, Hey, we here is a we talked about this in another video here.

39:45 I'll put the link here and there's the link which takes you and keeps you on a platform. So I could see with podcasting that referencing another video. I'm sorry, I can't podcast referencing another podcast would be ideal because you're letting people who are listening to the first time know. Oh, I spoke about. That. And then they're going to go looking for that. But to throw it in the front, I agree with Ralph in the front every time. I'm going to learn to skip through it. I'm here to learn today. This might be my first time listening, but if you lace it in with just a few words here and there and talking about other episodes, you know, I think I'd like to make a practice of maybe at least two, you know, referencing, you know, we talked about that in a in another podcast.

40:32 So I think that internal linking or whatever we're going to you call it for podcasting episode referencing, there we go. Something like that is very important. And Renee, are we talking about because of the transcript, is that what we're talking about? Because audio is not picked up by CEO, right? I mean, so we're talking about the transcript that comes from. Is that what we're talking about? Well, for what I was talking about was as a listener, I'm going to skip through it. And as a listener, you're going to be advertising to me what your other episodes are. So I realized how well-rounded you are. But yeah, if you're going to have show notes and or transcript in here, yeah, then that's going to be picked up by YouTube SEO.

41:14 And I don't know much about podcast SEO. I'm still figuring that out. More to come on that, Renee. We're going to be, we're going to be bringing in a guest to talk about that in the next couple weeks. So stay tuned there. Oh, good episode referencing there, Mark. Very good, Very good. Thank you. Appreciate that. Phil, did you want to add something? Just to jump off of what Renee was saying, yeah. And what Dr. said, if you reference your episode, it's going to show up in the SEO of your transcript. Because both, we all know transcripts are being used by Apple, by Spotify, YouTube, all the big platforms are coming out saying, hey, you need a transcript.

41:56 We're going to give you a transcript and Google's going to search it. All the search engines are going to search it her. It's the sound effects 1 for me that's the biggest thing. But she just needs one sentence to say, hey, last week we we covered the injuries this week we're going to cover this like get right to the point. Yes, hardcore listeners will be able to skip with the 30 seconds or 15 seconds. New listeners are going to be like, oh, OK, this is what they talked last week. I'll go listen to it. But it's more important to listen to this episode going over like everything that's going to that just me off. I'm like I'm not listening. I don't have time. I want to get to the point.

42:37 Tell me what this episode is about and going less about what she's talking about into her show notes and her show description. They need to be a bit more robust right now. They're very plain. Yes, she's using good keywords inside of it, but she's not giving us more because some people just want to read really quickly. And if it doesn't hook because it most of them say in this episode, in this episode, which people are just going to bypass because it's so bland. It doesn't hook your attention. You have to treat your show notes kind of like A blog and you want to capture their attention in the the show notes. Good stuff.

43:18 Thank you, Phil. Appreciate that. And also Speaking of good stuff, Dave Campbell in the chat shared pod seo.com. He's saying it's a great tool. So I've just thrown that out there from another experienced fellow podcaster. And by the way, Dave, you know, for whatever reason, I was using the Spotify for creators app. I was in there playing around with our podcast and I stumbled into the comments section. And Dave has been somebody who contributes to the comments over on Spotify on individual episodes on from time to time. He'll, he'll leave comments and one of the comments he left, I, this was like 20 weeks ago, he had suggested, hey, Mark, we must have been talking about improv. He said, hey, Mark, I think improv would be a great workshop for you to do at your conference at Empowered Podcasting. And lo and behold, I guess that's where I got the idea, Dave, because I, my reply was, hey, great idea. And we went ahead and did that.

44:17 I just forgot that you were the one that suggested it. So thank you, Dave. Appreciate you because that was one of the biggest hits of the whole conference. With that, I think we should play another clip because we only have about 10 minutes or so to go here. Let's see here. Where am I in our yes, here we are. Sharon is telling us a quick, patient story about minimalist flats and Achilles issues. It's a good test of whether expertise feels human. So let's play that clip. When I'm helping runners in the clinic pick shoes, here's my checklist. So #1 it must have a stable heel counter.

45:02 That firm section at the back keeps your heel from wobbling. If it's floppy, your rear foot is going to be unstable, which can contribute to Ankylos problems, plantar fascia problems, and knee issues. The second thing that's important is the midsole cushioning that matches your mileage and terrain, so if it's too soft and you sink then you can. Overwork. Your stabilizing muscles. I'm playing the wrong clip. That's not the story, that's the shoe checklist. So I think it's a good place to stop anyway.

45:42 I mean, there was a little bit more, but I think that people got the right idea. I'll play the other clip in just a second. I'm just mad at myself for the wrong setup. But anyway, what do you guys think about the details? We heard like two or three clips. Again, I will say I think she used sound effects there. Well, I don't think she overdid it. I like the emphasis to each point. I think it ties it together. But any other thoughts? What do you think about maybe the energy? What do you think of the languaging she's using? Is she's talking about the each point too much, too little? Let's hear it and I will start with sit again. I'm not a huge fan of the sound design of this. I think it's too much, right?

46:24 So I know it's come up a couple of times, but I just think it's so maybe a little bit overkill, but I did like the checklist. I listened to this episode again this morning just to prepare again for this. I liked the checklist. I think it was pretty easy. But the problem that I have with it is I am almost her ideal client because I'm a Walker. And some of the things she's talking about do apply to me because I've had a struggle with shoes because every three months I'm buying new shoes so I can identify with some of this content. But in that particular, in some cases throughout this episode, including this clip that you just played, she's talking over my head. She's using words and phrases that I don't understand, which kind of make me feel like, well, I don't know anything about this because she just mean, I don't know much about my foot, if you will. And so I wish that she would simplify the language a little bit or explain some of the medical terms so that I understood what she was talking about. So she was talking at me.

47:23 I mentioned this in my forum. She's talking at me throughout this episode and not talking to me. That's some good feedback. Thank you, Sid. I think that is important. You have to think about who your audience is and are they going to follow along with the terminology, the jargon, etcetera that you're using. I think it is important to call it out. I know we tried to do that here from time to time. We'll, we'll start getting into something and I'll, I'll notice that you know what, maybe some newer podcasters need a little more context and I'll stop and I'll throw in that context. I think that is important. Dr. did you want to comment on this? Because I think actually this clip was 1 you suggested we played. The sound issue was getting in my way on that one.

48:03 You mean her Her audio in particular? Yeah, her audio, I think she held her authority on this. I'm OK with with this clip of what we just heard. OK. And I see Sid is saying her target seems to be an advanced runner. We don't really know that, right? She's speaking as if it's an advanced runner. But at the same time, I feel like some of the things she's she's laying out for us, the advanced runner may already know about, right? I feel like this might be more, it's just my opinion. It feels like it might be more supposed to be more targeted toward beginners and intermediate, but she's talking to them as if they're advanced. I think that's what we're hearing perhaps.

48:46 And Mark, I think that this section could have been good if it was packaged better, if there was a stronger hook, if there was something that was, if it was easier to digest in general, the whole section would have been a stronger thing. I think one of the things that she's missing throughout the episode are the hooks that bring people from one section to the next. And that's really would improve the flow and the feel of the of the episode, in my opinion. Thank you, Jonathan and Ralph, do you want to share what you just shared in the chat? I think it would be much more effective if she leaned into the pain that the listener is feeling because that's what I'm missing here. Like how is this helping me? What it What am I feeling?

49:27 Why do I want to listen to what you have to say? What am I experiencing that you can help me with? I think I would have been much more effective. OK. Fairpoint, Thank you. Appreciate that. All right. I want to keep it moving because I do want to play one or two more clips, so let's just do that now. I already gave you the setup because I incorrectly set up the last clip, so I'm just going to go ahead and play it for you. I once had a patient training for 1/2 marathon in an ultra minimalist racing flats because quote, they made me feel fast. Problem was his calves weren't conditioned for that much load. Within weeks he had anchovies. Tendonopathy.

50:10 He lost six weeks of training right before his race. So here's a take away. It's not about the shoe alone. It's about how your foot and the. Shoe work together. There you go. So let's not talk about the sound effects anymore. I think we've we've drilled that down enough when we have enough differences of opinions. I want to actually, I see Dr. wants to share. But Jonathan, I think this was a clip that you had suggested we play. So I want to check back in with you. What are your thoughts on this? Because she did do a brief storytelling and you're somebody who likes to preach about storytelling. So what say you, Sir?

50:52 You know, I love a good story, and I think that the story should have been a bigger part of everything in the episode. I think she could have really brought it back, like Ralph was saying. This could have been the moment where, you know, this is the pain you're feeling. Here's what you need to do to make it, you know, improve it. This could have tied. I mean, I would have done the whole episode on this story and explain the story and giving people value from that particular story, in my opinion. But I think it still could have, even if you're just not doing that, use it more to connect with her audience and talk about the pain and talk about, you know, what you do to fix it. Yeah, thank you, Jonathan. And I saw Ralph agreed with you in the chat as well. So for the sake of time, gang, I had one more clip. It's her call to action at the end. I think that we can skip that for now. I think she does a good job with it. I think that she could do a little bit more with it as well. But let's just jump for a second. Can anybody share with us what's something that you think she did really well with this episode?

51:58 But I want to get some positive. I mean, not that we haven't, we haven't been super negative, but we have been giving constructive criticism and I want to make sure we're balancing that a little bit. Anyone have something that they feel like she's doing really well? Well, you know, I'm not a runner, but I did learn some stuff because she it kept me engaged. It kept me wanting to hear more. And you know, for a non runner, I think that's pretty spectacular. Yeah, awesome. Love that. I'm going to go to Ashley and then I'm going to go to Renee. Go ahead, Ashley. I thought she was fantastically concise. Of all the things she did, she in most sections she was straight to the point, short and sweet, and the episode wasn't too long.

52:44 Yes, and thank you for pointing out all of that. And that last point too, I think, and it looks that to be this way for all episodes of hers, they're all around 15 minutes. I think that's a great length for what she's doing. And side note, looking at her episodes, the one thing I'm seeing is they're not coming out consistently on the same day of the week. I'm not sure why that is, but I would just recommend to Sharon pick a day and commit to that day so that your audience knows when they can expect that next episode. OK, Renee, coming to you. Give us something that you think that Sharon's doing really well with her podcast. I agree with Dr. I'm not a runner. I'm a joker. Like I'm between jogging and walking. What that's what I call it.

53:28 And I just think that I now want to go listen to that episode where she goes down. What are the best shoes? Because I've had bad shoes. I have a good pair of running shoes and then I have OK shoes. So before I invest another X amount of dollars, I'm going to listen to that episode. So even though I didn't really understand everything she was talking about, I'm going to have to open up Google next to it and figure out what part of the shoe is she talking about. I think she's talking about the firm back of the shoe, but I want to be sure. So I have these things and then, you know, it would be great. In her show notes is a link to the checklist that you can take to the store with you. And so she would have a link that gets her to her website if she has one, which is going to give her, you know, more traffic, which is good for for ranking.

54:13 So I thought that episode is going to get her another listen out of it. I really wanted to address the show notes just for a second. And we know we're over time, but you know, her show notes right now don't have any links, any of the resources that she talks about in her shows. This would be a good time for like affiliation. Is there a specific shoe that maybe she can be an affiliate of? Put that in your show notes with, you know, a link. Let me stop you there for a second. She could be an Amazon seller, right, And link to the shoes there. She could go on TikTok and do TikTok shop and promote and sell the shoes there. Absolutely, yeah.

54:53 Also this is just on the back end. Some like pro tips, think about having maybe a patient in that you can interview. This will probably get you more patients, but we'll also raise your authority as the doctor because you're talking to someone who you know you helped along the way. Your social media presence. I didn't see a whole lot. I saw something on Instagram called Runner Soul, but it was there was nothing on it and it was a completely different logo. It might have been yours. You might have gotten that URL early on and decided to change your logo. I'm not sure.

55:34 But there's just nothing on it to tell me that it's yours or not. So yeah. Great, great advice. Great, great observations. Thank you, Dr. Does anyone else want to chime in before we wrap this up? I want to say, even though I don't know if Sharon really knows that we're doing this, we're going to make sure she does. But and and to be clear, she put this out there publicly. Please listen to my podcast and give me feedback. I'm new and want to learn to grow, right? So we're just doing that for her right here. And I hope that this brings her some extra downloads. As we were saying yesterday, I'm curious to to hear clearly. We know she's going to get one more cuz Renee says she's going to listen. And she got a handful more from all of us here on the podcasting morning chat who've been listening this week. And I'm really loving this format. Can we do it once a week?

56:26 We shall see because as Dr. pointed out, it was a lot of work to get it all together. But I really enjoy this and I think we could do a lot with this and I think it will only improve with time. And I specifically to this episode, I love that each that we each picked up different things from her expertise to where she can dial in her hooks. We didn't really get into the call to action, but I think she did overall a good job with that. There's a lot she's doing right, and with just a few of some of these tweaks that we've shared, especially things like maybe a better microphone, better audio quality, things like that, maybe finding a proper balance with the sound effects and transitions, she's killing it. I'm confident that with those tweaks, she's going to have a very successful podcast.

57:17 So good luck to the runner's soul, good luck to Sharon. We will be cheering you on and maybe we'll get her to come join us one day and talk a little more about her show with us. We're back tomorrow at 7:00 AM. Eastern talking all things podcasting and of course, wrapping up Friday's episode, wrapping up our week with our wins. So come bring any wins that you've celebrated this past week or that you want to celebrate for the first time with us on Friday morning. We'd love to hear about it. Bonus points if it's specific to podcasting and content creation. Check us out at podpage.com/PMC. That's where you'll find all of our previous episodes. Learn more about us and check the show notes. I will cross fingers have a link to have your podcast evaluated if you are interested.

58:08 Until tomorrow, Make it a great day everybody. Take care.