307 - Why Your Audience Won’t Stick Without A Solid Community

0:04 Good morning, podcasting Morning Chat. Today is Monday, May 19th, 2025, and today we're digging into what it really means to build a podcast community, not just grow an audience, and why that difference might change everything. So if you're listening live on Clubhouse, hit the share button, bottom left hand side of the screen and share it. However Clubhouse lets you. And if you're listening via podcast, please share this episode with a fellow podcaster. And now give us about 30 seconds and we'll get things rolling. Thanks for being here.

1:21 Good morning again, podcasting Morning Chat. Thank you for being here. It seems that I've got a bit of a frog in my throat, which I was not expecting this morning, so bear with me. Kermit out of there? Yes, Kermit out of there. Yeah, I don't know what's going on. It's I guess maybe not used to talking this early in the morning. I definitely did not do the 5:00 AM club thing on my vacation. I took a break from that and enjoyed some rest and relaxation. I mean, I think I probably slept in. The latest I probably slept in was eight, 9:00 in the morning, which, you know, that's an extra 3-4 hours for me. So I was very appreciative of the break. And before I go any further, I want to take a moment to express some deep gratitude.

2:12 First, I want to say a huge thank you to Dr. Fey, to producer Ashley Feller and Sid Meadows. Not just for really holding everything down in front of the mic, but for everything you guys did behind the scenes while I was away. Your leadership, your consistency, your heart for this community kept things running smoothly while I was away, and I am so grateful for that. And I also want to thank the amazing people who stepped up and LED powerful discussions and also helped behind the scenes over the past couple of weeks. Again, Sid Meadows, definitely one of those people. Jonathan Howard, Matt Bliss, Dominic Lawson, who carved out time in the middle of launching his new show, Mental Health Rewritten, Dan Moore, Heidi, Alex Baelish. All of you, thank you.

3:06 Each of you brought brought your own voice and energy to this space, and you helped to make sure our community kept showing up. It was a total pleasure. Yeah, you help them keep learning. You help grow together. Thank you all really, truly for showing what community looks like in action. You all helped prove what the power of building community does for a podcast over these last couple of weeks. So today I want to unpack that a little bit more. I want to get into what does it really mean to build a community around your podcast or your content, not just racking up listeners or followers. How can we tell if we've created something people feel connected to?

3:53 And these past two weeks was certainly a way I can tell that I've created something that people can actually feel connected to. So we'll get into that in a few. 1st, I'm happy to share about my time away if anyone has any questions. So I will open the floor to that 'cause I don't want to just blow by a two week vacation and not share at all about it. I do have questions. OK, OK, OK. So the the first thing is, what was your most unexpected moment that you had? I think it was my love for the city of Madrid. And I say that because I'm not one that loves exploring cities.

4:38 And I know to some people that might seem crazy, but I'm just not a city guy. I get overwhelmed when I'm in a big city. And Madrid was definitely a a sizable city. But what I found was I know I wrote something down here about that actually, so I'm going to look at my notes here. Well, for one, it just felt so welcoming there. The people were really friendly. It was really easy to get around. It was clean, it was modern, It felt very safe and the food options were just out of this world unbelievable. I I mean, everywhere you turn, you could walk into a place and eat some of the most delicious food.

5:21 And I'm, I love tapas. I love eating that way. We get more small portions and everybody gets to share it. I love that kind of eating. And man, was it good eating. I'm a little tired of seafood, I got to say, because that's a big yeah, and especially in Lisbon. Paella. Well, the paella, that was probably the most fun I had in Madrid. We, if you guys followed at all on social media, my stories, my stepson is in Madrid or he was, he's back now in the States, but he was studying there. So we had him as a tour guide really, which made exploring the city so much more fun. But what? Was he studying Mark? Well, he's studying business, but a lot of these colleges and universities now have these study abroad programs. And he'll tell you, he'll tell you it's kind of a cakewalk the semester they they really make it pretty simple. And he got to explore, I forget what it was 3 or 4 dozen different cities in Europe on the weekends and what have you. So he had a blast, but one of the things he did was he set us up for a class, a paella making class, and he's done it at this point now.

6:34 I think it was his third or fourth time doing it. Anybody who comes to visit, he was taking them to these classes. It was a group of probably 15 of us people from all different countries, a few from the USA, few from Germany and elsewhere. It was just so fun to mingle with all these people and learn some culture while we were there and how to make some of their most prized foods. Those paellas is they're a big thing there. And this was this chef who hosted this. He was a pretty popular chef, had a really popular restaurant in Madrid and ended up having to shut it down during or right after COVID. And he then found this opportunity and he teaches these classes.

7:20 I think it was something like 15 of them a week. He just has a blast doing it, you can tell. And it was great. Also, we got to make sangrias while we were we were doing this class that was bottomless sangria. So by the end you're definitely having a great time with maybe a little help with the alcohol too. But it was one of the most delicious dishes we had the whole time we were there. So that that was a great experience. And like I said, Madrid definitely surprised me, being really one of the favorite cities I've ever been to. Awesome. Yeah, I saw Ashley's hand up. Hey, Ashley, look at Dr. Still taking control of the show. I love it. Good, Ashley.

8:02 Good morning. Hey, good morning. You kind of already answered my question. I was going to ask what was the best thing you ate on your travels and I guess I have another question. How many photos do you think you took? Oh, man, IA lot. I don't even know. I have to go back and look, but definitely a lot of photos, especially between the two of us, Amy and I, we yeah, we captured a lot of it. And I think my favorite photos was, you know what, actually right before I joined you guys last week and shared a little bit and I was telling you I was about to get on a boat and that boat took us to this area called the Bengal Cave or Caves. And it's apparently the most iconic sea cave that specifically the Bengal cave in Algarve, which is in Portugal and it's located near the village of Bengal. And it's known for these massive Dome like shaped caves and also these cliffs that go just border along the whole coastline of this particular area.

9:11 And it's really one of the most beautiful sights I've seen, not just in that area, but just in general. And there's the specific one, this Bengal cave, it's there. When you go into this Dome cave, you see there's this big circle at the top, and it's just this big open area that lets light in. It's actually the tour guide was telling us it's the infamous screensaver for those that use Windows 10 or have used Windows 10. Apparently that's one of the default screensavers is this particular cave and it's just breathtaking to go. It's one of those things that I could sit here and try to describe it to you, but you can't really take it in until you actually see it. It's only accessible by the ocean. There's three ways you can do it. You can use a kayak and go through this cave and many of the other caves with the kayak or a stand up paddle board. We took the boat tour, which the only downside of that is you don't really get to go through a lot of the caves except that one, the Bengal cave in particular. But yeah, it was a awesome experience and a great way to connect with nature.

10:20 We just, we loved it. Again, I want to say thank you all for allowing me to do that. I think, by the way, I should say one of the best parts of this vacation was it was almost entirely paid for, not by me, not by my wife. We had an excessive amount of points with hotels, air miles with airlines, and the whole thing probably cost us well under $1000 to do this whole 2 week trip, which was mind blowing and so grateful that we were able to make it work that way because it could have been a very, very expensive trip. And by the way, that cost didn't include meals and such, but everything else as far as where we stayed, everything was pretty much covered. So really grateful for that and certainly would have been very reflective when it comes to being able to do this. And, you know, taking two weeks off and and make if the alternative was to not have the show at all. And the fact that you all took the reins really meant the world to me.

11:29 And so I want to start with this question for you all. When it comes to what you all did, I'm curious if we could reflect what was it like hosting the show while I was away? What did you learn through this process? And I think maybe Dr. And Ashley, you're probably the best people to start with since I know you guys were really leading the charge for the most part. So yeah, what was it like and what did you learn, Dr. Well, the hardest part for me was checking the chat, making sure I saw the hands go up, keeping an eye on our inter message system that we have going, also the rundown, keeping an eye on that at the same time and just that to keep all of those balls in the air. That was the hardest part for me. And certainly I have a new appreciation for you. Your I'll tell you what your transitions from like when someone says something and you know you have to call on someone else.

12:38 Your transitions are so effortless and so good. And I try, I tried to channel you, but it's just I felt like I was giving people the bums rush and I just I it that upset me. Oh God, I don't know. I don't know. I appreciate that I don't know what to call it, but that that what do you call it? I guess that you notice how challenging that can be. And you know, I've often said it, I don't, I don't engage with the chat, the live chat very often because it's too difficult for me to juggle all those balls. I have to decide which ones to put down and let you all control.

13:18 But yeah, I, I know that there's a lot and I'm glad that you guys also had each other, you know, all of you to support one another. I know there were a lot of things going on, including I know sometimes Ashley was running sounds and the music and clips. And I think Dan was doing. That too. And yeah. Friday was a shit show. I'm sure that Ashley would be more than happy to tell you what was going on. Yeah, I know. I know you guys had a had a hard time on Friday and I know at least I was happy to still be somewhat behind the scenes and follow you guys in the private chats that was going on. And I know one of the big things, especially with UDR, at least initially, was making sure that we fill the entire hour.

14:01 And I know I probably sounded like a broken record after a while. Just reminding everyone, there's no rule. There are no rules here. It's your show, especially while I'm gone. And if the show doesn't go an hour, that's fine. If it goes 30 minutes and then you guys feel like, yeah, I'm kind of running out of conversation here. And the show, it's totally cool. There's no, nothing's going to happen if we don't go a full hour. And that's why there are sometimes where when we do this show, I'll say, I'll say to you, you know, I'm going to give you guys 5 minutes back of your time if we're ending 5 minutes early because, yeah, sometimes the conversation is run its course and there's no reason to push further.

14:43 And I know that was a little bit of a stress thing for some of you guys. And I'm glad that you worked it out. Let's see anyone else. What, what have, what have you learned? You know, let let me. Yeah. OK. I'll go to Ashley. And then I was going to go to Jonathan 'cause I know Jonathan hosted a room as well, and I wanted to hear what he learned hosting a room here in the podcasting morning chat specifically. But first, let me go to Ashley. Good morning, Ashley. Good morning. I learned to take a lot more deep breaths. I had it. It went really well. While you're on vacation, I'm really appreciative to Dan, who helped record a lot of the shows and also helped out with the music. And it, it taught me to be a little more patient with myself because there were a few more things to do than what normally is part of the workflow.

15:33 For example, almost every day the intro needed a little bit of TLC because it's, it's pretty tough to get the mix right when the speaker is on one end, then the music is coming from another end. So just just a lot more patience than usual. Yeah, I hear that, I hear that. And Jonathan, you hosted a room and I'm curious how you felt it went and if there was anything you learned from doing that. Would you do anything differently this time? Good morning to you and thank you for all of your help while I was gone. Good morning, good morning. And I will tell you that anybody who came in to host a show, it was pretty much cakewalk because Ashley and Dr. had everything figured out in the back end, didn't have to worry about anything, just kind of do your thing.

16:22 So I was very lucky. So very true. I mean, every night we were getting a rundown of everything and what we needed to expect. It was, it was very, very well done. Yeah. I want to cut you off real quick and just say, yeah, I mean, what Dr. and Ashley were doing as far as providing the team with a rundown and outline of the show the next day, that's more than I do. And I was starting to feel a little insecure, like, oh, crap, maybe I should be doing that for everybody as well. So yeah, that I was really appreciative to see that kind of touch on the show while I was gone. OK. Go ahead, Jonathan. I did run a show on having a signature style for your podcast, which is actually the first time I ran that entire kind of program that I'm trying to put together for podcasting. So I learned a lot about, you know, what worked, what didn't work, and what I'm going to do differently and what other things I might need to make it be a little bit clearer. So I'm glad that I got to do that, but I think people also got something out of it, so I'm happy with that. Awesome.

17:26 I'm glad that. And that's really cool that you got to test something out like that. And I want to encourage everybody, not just the leaders here on this stage, anybody who's a part of our community, if there's ever a time that you would like to test the waters and lead a discussion in the morning, this is your show too. And I'm happy to take the back seat or maybe the passenger seat next to you, the copilot seat if you will, and allow you to do this. Those kinds of things we want to learn about you just as much as we want to learn about the content that we share with that we put out there for our community. And if you've got something that you think is valuable to provide to this community, let's do it.

18:11 So reach out to me at any time and let me know and we can talk it through and figure it out. I would love to do that more often. And by the way, I think Nick, you I know were here and there. I think you were pretty busy while I was away. So yeah, where were you? What was going on with you while I was away? Hey, good morning. Welcome back. Thanks. Yeah, this the like the last probably 3 weeks have just been absolute chaos for me. Like doing the move. We last night brought the last load from the old house to the new house and close on all that this morning or going to be closing on all that this morning. But just dealing with getting things like, you know, like we just got Internet on Friday.

19:04 We've been in the house the whole week. And that was a whole, that was a whole deal. That was a big snafu. I was not happy. But just deal with contractors and everybody that's in and out of the house. I felt like I've been running 1,000,000 miles a minute. So yeah, I was, I was in and out of this room quite a bit between dealing with all that stuff. But we're finally, we have Internet, we have everything at the house. I think we have the other closing today and then we're just done. Then we can really starting packing everything. Yeah, yeah, I, I know the feeling, my man. I know the feeling. There is a lot of moving parts there and I'm glad you were able to show up when you could.

19:50 Thank you for showing up when you could and congratulations. It's very cool that you guys are closing today and very cool that you guys were able to get so much done and be in that house before the closing, because that's generally not how it works. So very cool that you guys were able to do that. So we actually, we closed on the House that we moved into earlier in the month. So we were able to start getting stuff moved over. But then the house that we sold, we're closing on that 1 today. Got it. And. That we ended up, we had a mover, we had some guy that brought a massive truck to help move all of our stuff. And even after all of that, it was like we had so much big things that we needed to move ourselves.

20:33 So it's been like a I've never left work and just gone straight to the new house. It was always leave work and go to the old house to grab stuff. And now today's going to be the first day I can just go straight home, which feels kind of good. Yeah, that's awesome. Congratulations. That's very cool. Thank you. And glad to see the whole gang here. All right, so anyone else just if there's anything, what did you notice as far as when I was gone and you all were leading the charge? Anything you learned? Anything you noticed? Now's the chance or else we can move into more about this idea of community because I think it's very appropriate that we talk about building community when we see what what's possible with this very community, what we're able to accomplish. Anyone else have anything?

21:23 If not, I will move on. OK, I'm going to move on then. So let's talk about it. Let's first, is there any podcast that besides this show? I know it's it's such the easy answer to say this show. Is there any podcast that you listen to, watch, consume regularly that you think has done a really good job of building community over audience? That you can tell that the community is a big part of what that podcaster does? I'm curious if there's something that you could share, an example someone could share of a podcast that does this really well.

22:04 I was going to say that our guest on Friday, Thursday, Friday, Wednesday, I don't know what day Amanda Yoa has a has done a really good job building out a community of people, you know that listen to a podcast and call in and she runs rooms over on the other app with that community as well. So yeah, she's done a really good job kind of building out that community. Yeah, I really enjoyed that episode with Amanda and you all talking about adding humor to your podcast. And yes, I've seen what she's been doing too with with her community and building up a community like that. I think that's awesome. Jonathan, is there something specific you think that she does well in that regard? I think the biggest thing for Amanda, she's just so relatable. She has just a connection that's natural with her, her audience, with her people on social media, even with her character that she plays.

22:59 It's just a natural connection that I think people feel with her. So when you have that, it makes it a little bit easier, but it's still work. Yeah, absolutely. Is. I think an example for me is somebody I see that does it really well is Alex Sanfilippo and you know, pod matches his brand and his podcast Podcasting Made Simple. He's really built quite a community around everything that he does. And I think the way that I see he does it is he does, I think it's something similar that I do. He really connects with people individually that are a part of his community, a part of his brand. He, he makes it personal.

23:43 If they've posted something, he'll comment on it. You know, if they post a new episode or if they post something really valuable for the independent podcaster, he's he'll respond to it. He'll give you your kudos. I there's something. And if they're in, if they're having a personal crisis, he's one of those people that will reach out to that person and privately and connect with him. I know this about him because he's done that with me and I've had others tell me he does that with them. I think making things personal with your community and really connecting with people on an individual level, I think that's a huge component to building a community over building an audience. And Dr., Did you have an example you were going to share? Well, the only one that I can think of is Ask the podcast coach with Dave Jackson.

24:42 You know, on Saturdays he runs a live YouTube show that's about an hour and a half to two hours long. People ask questions that it's very much like what we do here. And even he has. I would not have said that unless I heard him say that first and when he was talking about our show. And that's the only other show Flash community that I can actually think of. Yeah, and of course the often mentioned Pat Flynn I think is another example as well. I think Pat Flynn does an amazing job building community over audience.

25:24 So yeah, check out what he does with his communities if you're interested in that. And then I saw that Alex has something, and so does Ashley. Let me go to Alex first. Good morning, Alex. Yeah, I got a couple. One is from this group called Bigger Pockets. It's about buying and selling and renting houses. They've got several podcasts, they've got a couple of books and and they're really about the community, depending on what level of investing you're in. And I, I have, I have to say this year or actually in the past year, the WNBA podcast. I know James stopped doing his, but there's been a ton of podcasts out there. Adrian Ross show been Ben Daniels podcast. You know, they're really kind of embracing, you would think, you know, sport is only, you know, 6-6 months long. They're talking about it all year round. And you know, they're doing memberships, they're doing all sorts of stuff as well.

26:25 So there is a lot and it's pretty amazing how they're continuing to produce content all year round and and also just engage with their their fans or listeners. Yeah, yeah. I think that's such a key is that engagement with the listeners and really knowing, getting to know not just your audience as a whole, but like I was saying earlier, getting to know people individually. I think there's something so it makes that listener on the other side feel seen, feel heard, feel special in some way when when that host that they're going to and listening to on a regular basis, actually showing that they care.

27:07 I'm certainly not, pardon me, I'm certainly not suggesting you fake it, right? But if there's somebody in your community that you see or hear could use a little support as a host, if you reach out and and show that support, that genuine support, it goes a long way. Just, you know, again, it's not, it's I'm not, I don't want you to fake it, but I think it's really important to connect with people on that human level. But Mark, sometimes it goes the other way. What I mean by that is, you know, a lot of us feel like we're in a bubble when we podcast. So we don't know what's going on with the listeners.

27:49 You know, we don't even know anybody's listening. And yet you see these numbers and you're like, OK, I have 100 people that listen or 20 people that listen, but who are these people really? And what's really kind of fascinating is when they actually kind of reach out to you and, and say something to you about your podcast, how it's affected them. I mean, as a podcast right now, you've had this, everybody probably said this in the room. It's pretty amazing. Like, Oh my gosh, they listen to my little podcast. And I think that that's that's where I think the beginning of it, it starts at least for for us, when we started doing our podcast for what it's from, like, wow, we actually are impacting people and has nothing to do with the show in the sense of it wasn't just about the show, it was about more. And I think that that's where the good stuff starts. So I think it can work both ways from the. I'm with you, Alex.

28:44 I think that's such an important point and I appreciate you bring it up, bringing it up because it's reminding me when you said, especially when you said like 100 listeners, 20 listeners. I know a lot of podcasters will will come to me if that's the size of their audience and say, yeah, all this engagement talk is great. But I don't hear from those 20 people, those 25 people, how do I get them to connect to? How do I get them to reach out to me? And there are so many strategies out there about how to create engagement, right? And I think sometimes we try those tools, those tips, and they fall short, right?

29:26 Well, you know, OK, I'm doing this thing. I'm asking a question, but nobody's answering the question. I think one of the best ways that's often not talked about in this way to get people to connect with you, to reach out to you, to start building those individual relationships is by sharing your own struggles, your own challenges, things that you are going through as a person. If you are, if you share that, what I'd find is that I hear from people, people start to reach out to me. Mark, I heard you talking about X and I want you to know that I've been through that and I'm sometimes it's the response is as simple as I'm here if you ever want to talk about it, right, the doors open up went because you've provided that community so much value that when you start to talk about something that you're challenged with that community's ears perk up, especially if they've been through it too. And then they want to pay you back and give you value after you've been providing so much value. It honestly I think is probably the easiest way to get an audience to start engaging with you. And then when they do that, then you can share and you can connect with them on that, that deeper in that deeper way. And that's where the

30:58 relationships start. I will say, I know you want to go to Jeff real quick. The one of the things that I've seen that's had the most growth when it comes to that is it happened with Chris and Amanda. It happened with us and it's happening with those people that I was talking about the WNBA people is doing lives. I got to tell you, you talk about getting great engagement and how to do a jump start for your podcast in terms of people want to, you know, keep wanting to listen because that's what it's all about. It's your personality. You can interact with the actual host, you can interact with the actual listeners. I'm not saying it's for everyone.

31:39 I I'm not saying that it is for everyone, but I will say you look at what Chris and Amanda do and it's pretty amazing. I mean, they've got their regulars and then people can kind of come back and then they supplement it with other content that is pre recorded. So maybe they don't, but a lot of people might do supplemental pre recorded content like a traditional podcast and it can, it can really kind of build. So just food for thought. Yeah, absolutely. And I think when it can work really well is when you start making those individual connections with your community and then you start doing lives. You can reach out to those individuals and say, hey, I'm going to be doing this live.

32:19 I I don't want to do it by myself. Are you free? If I do it on this day at this time, I, I do that all the time. I will reach out to people individually or maybe as a small group that I know support me here in the morning. I'll reach out if I'm doing something else, something different and I'll ask them. I, I'll make it personal. Yes, I'll put it in things like my newsletter. I might put, you know, an, an, an announcement. I'm going to be going live on whatever Instagram Tiktok on this day and time. And that might bring in some people. But I think when when you have the individual connections and you reach out and ask, people respond and they will show up if if they're free. And at that day and time, I think that's so important. Before I go to Jeff, I did mention I was going to go to Ashley.

33:08 So Ashley, did you want to add on to this? Yeah. I just wanted to add that I think an example of a podcaster who's really leaned in into form a community is Steve Stewart. You know, he's got the podcasters editor's Academy, the podcast, and then the whole Facebook group and then the whole mastermind. And when you you know, he he's one of the first people you meet at podcast if you go exploring the hallways. And he's always very friendly. And one of the first questions he'll ask you is So what software do you use to edit your podcast? And that always kicks off a great discussion. So I'd say Steve Stewart. Yeah, I wholeheartedly agree. Yes, he is built quite a community and he, you know, similarly to what we did here over the past two weeks, he does that sometimes with his booths at these trade shows. He has his his editing community. And if he can't man the booth the whole time, people volunteer to man that booth for him.

34:08 And again, that's the power of community is you don't have to do it alone. And the more that you bring in more people to help, the more it starts to grow and it becomes something special and not just another podcast. So I'm with you there, Ashley. He he does a great job. Jeff, good morning. Welcome to the stage. What did you want to add to this? Good morning. A couple of things. We're kind of talking around it. You know, when we we talk about what we can do that would encourage people to feel comfortable to reaching out to us, doing lives so that they might reach out to us. And I think the thing we have to remember is that most of the people that are listening are listening because they think of themselves as listeners and they're never going to automatically feel like they're on the same level we are as leaders, speakers, whichever.

35:06 I know that everybody in here has heard me talk about Maddie True, my artist that I work with. And when I first met her, yes, she did come up to me and talk to me, but I had to follow up with her directly. Like what you just said, Mark, you know, reaching out to people because I had to recognize that when she Googles me, she's going to see my resume. She's going to see that I've done this and I've done that and I've got a podcast and I've got this and she's very likely going to get intimidated and she's going to think I was being nice when I said, give me a call and, and we can collaborate. And so I reached out to her and said, no, I, when I said, if you want to get together and have coffee, I meant it. And I've done that a lot with people. And I think that in the context of what we're talking about, if you find that you've only got 20 people listening, but you have a way to reach out to one of those 20 people. But then you take that the experience or the whatever you do with that one person and engage them and repurpose that into your content, then it lets the other 19 people know, oh wow, the person that that's that, did that sound bite with him?

36:21 They're like me. That's that's not him saying, I promise I'll be nice if you reach out to me. They have an example of when it it really did include somebody like them. And that provides a little say, for example, of, oh, I can't engage because I saw somebody else engage and they're one of my peers. So I think that can maybe warm up the door handle for some folks. Yeah, it's the difference between talking the talk and walking the walk. You can sit there and say all the time, you know, please reach out to me and I'll do this that and the other thing when, if and when you do that, it's another thing to actually show the example show in real time you connecting with somebody who's a part of that community that they're that makes the biggest impact, I think, out of any of these strategies.

37:12 Yeah, show what you're doing, bring people into the community, into the podcast and put that out there for the rest to see. And like you said, start to relate. Like, yeah, that's me or that could be me. And now that helps the the wheels turn for them to reach out to you with whatever their questions are, with whatever they want to discuss with you and your community. I think that's so important, Jeff. Thank you. And Jonathan, you wanted to add to that. I just wanted to say, I think, you know, Mark, you're a great example if you've done that work and it's starting to pay off because you've got, I mean, just look down in the audience right now. And I think each and every one of these people at some point has come up and contributed to the show and been a part of the show and asked really good questions that have gotten us on good discussions. So I think you you're starting to see the fruit of your laborers now, and that's really awesome because you know, you've done a lot of work in this community, but the community is now turning out for you even when you're not here. Absolutely.

38:15 Thank you for that. I appreciate that. And you're right, I'm looking at at the people in the audience right now and I'm, I think pretty much everybody in the audience has been up on this stage and contributed a ton of value to this community. Such a great point. I appreciate that Jonathan, and I appreciate all of you people who show up here all the time when even if you're not up on stage contributing, you're doing it in the chat or your, your presence is your contribution. And I, I accept that just as much as those other ways we just described. So thank you. I, I do appreciate that. And somebody newer to our community and has been really contributing quite often lately is Janae, who is on stage with us right now. Janae, did you want to add to this conversation? Good morning.

39:02 Good morning. Good morning. Welcome back, Mark. It's been amazing watching this community and being part of the community. And this is something that I've been missing for a few years, being part of the community. What do I mean? Well, I am part of the larger podcasting community. And back in 2019, I joined another community. And you probably have no Heather parody. She had a community called Unconventional Leaders and Facebook and the pandemic, we would come together every single day and have, you know, hour long Zoom call. So this is just around time Clubhouse was just coming alive and that community really helped me to come out of my shell.

39:44 They're like, hey, you can be who you want to be. And I think that's the power of communities when they invite you and they show you that you are all that you need to be, you are enough to, you know, lead the way to do what you want to do. So that's been really amazing to be part of a community. So I see that happening here. I see so many people here that are amazing. They're building their smaller communities and I just love all of that. And if you think about it right, these large entrepreneurs or large celebrities, they started small. They started to. Contributing and the the most recent example that I can point to is Pat Flynn's the deep pocket monster entire his entering back into the the Pokémon community. I've seen his live stream when he's doing on Deep Pocket Monster, and there's like 2000 people watching that thing. Yeah.

40:43 It's kind of crazy how he entered that community, he became part of it, and then he's like, hey, here's what I'm doing. And they all showed up. So inviting people, being part of other people's communities and then having that courage to even go out there. So thank you. I love this talk. Thank you. And that's such a great point. I mean, being a part of other communities and engaging with those communities, building relationships with people within those communities, I think that does a lot for you. And you're the one that you're trying to build because now you've got people that you can reach out to and ask for support. That's a big thing. And I know I talked about it a few minutes ago, but really connecting with people and reaching out then and not being afraid to ask them to come support you.

41:31 I think there are so many podcasters out there that feel like, you know, they can't ask and they feel weird about asking for support. They want it to just magically happen. And I think it's it that just doesn't work. It's not a formula that works well. I think you've got to connect with people, and Janae does a great job also, and I want to point this out because it's something I think I need to do a little more of myself to continue to build what we're doing here. I see Janae on social media sometimes posting things unrelated to what he does in the podcasting space. You know, like one of his most recent posts on all the different social media platforms that I've seen him on was talking about whether or not you put ketchup on your eggs, right? And what happens when you do that? You create conversation because they're going to be people who are completely on board with the idea of putting ketchup on your eggs.

42:27 And then there are going to be people that are thoroughly disgusted by that. And both parties are going to want to comment on that. And it, it starts to create a foundation a, a relationship. I know that sounds silly maybe to some, and it really does because now you can start going back and forth and talking to them about it. And then now you now you're starting to connect with people and those people. Then again, when you're looking for support, you can reach out to those same people that you talked about your eggs with and ask them for that support. And they're going to be way more likely to do so. And that support could be, hey, would you be open to listening to my podcast? That could be the first question you ask them when you when you're ready to ask for some kind of support. That may be some way or like we were talking about earlier, I'm going to be doing a live, I haven't done many before. I would love to have people there just to be there to cheer me on, right?

43:24 And it can all stem from just having random conversations on social media, as an example. I love that he does that, and I want to do more of that, too. Anyone else want to add anything? Yeah, Jeff, go ahead. I just want to highlight what you just commented on, just to make sure that we see this aspect of it. When you're talking about the ketchup on the eggs thing and you're trying to get people to engage, you're helping them engage when you give them a binary choice, do you like it? Do you like ketchup on your eggs or do you not? Because a lot of people are hesitant to engage because they think they have to come up with something really lofty.

44:06 They have to come up with an idea from scratch. And, and if you, if you make it easy by giving them a this or that, then all they have to do is decide between the two. And once once they've done that, they kind of naturally expand on it. So, so giving somebody a this or that, do you like this song versus that song is much easier to comment on then what is your favorite song? And that kind of warms up everybody and gives them a way in that they can then get comfortable with and contribute more later. Absolutely. I know I've been caught in that trap myself on the other side of it where I see a question and it caught my attention, but then I felt like I had to come up with something really insightful or really outside the box. And then I don't comment at all.

44:55 But when I have an option to choose from, it's much easier for me to comment and then give a little bit more, give my opinion. Like in this case, yeah, I used to do ketchup on my eggs all the time. I I've kind of started to steer away from it, not because I don't like it. I've just now, I'm now hot sauce is my thing on my eggs and I I just enjoy it more than ketchup. Would I still eat ketchup on my eggs? Sure. But yeah, having a this or that, having an option, and that seems to help create more engagement. People are more open to sharing if they can just pick between one thing or the other and you'll start to see those opinions coming out. They're not generally.

45:38 They don't just say yes or no to eggs on your ketchup on your eggs. They'll say yes and they'll share passionately. Why? Especially if they see others saying, EW, that's disgusting. No way. Well, they're going to want to get in there and defend their their side of things. Yeah, Alex, go ahead. I was going to say that's an old sales booking technique, you know, just having two options and if you ever trying to book a client or whatever else, you give them two times, you give them two days or two times morning, afternoon and then two different times. And it's just like you said, it's just easier and it can, people don't want to think at the end of the day, they just don't want to think. They just want to do, I will say, you know, about community when it comes to this stuff, I really would say if you're trying to break that wall with your people and you are getting a lot of, you know, engagement doing lives, that's where you can, they can see your personality and they can, and they can maybe feel like they're a little bit more comfortable, like Jeff said, you know, to approach you because it's not in a formal setting.

46:45 I just think that that could really work. Yeah, I think it could too. I appreciate that, Alex. Yeah, it's so important. I think I'm trying to think here because we only have a few minutes left. I'm trying to think of the best way to wrap this up. I think maybe maybe it's this. I'll ask this question. What kind of leader does your community need you to be? And are you willing to become that? How can you be A, and I'll maybe rephrase it a little bit too, and just say, what can you, what else could you do as a leader to really make your, an audience start to feel like a community? We've shared some ways and I wanted to see if there's any other way that somebody feels like they can really make that difference for their audience. How can an audience feel like, yeah, this is more than a podcast?

47:36 I think for any community, one of the things that you can do is listen a whole lot more. It's not necessarily your job to say everything. You have a community of people that will say things, but it's your job to listen to what's being said so that you can have the value of your audience actually providing input and feedback for you. Because there's so many opportunities there that we're missing because we don't listen as well as we should. So Jonathan, what would you say to somebody who's like, OK, I'm willing to listen, but I'm not hearing my audience share anything. What would you say? You've got to get into the right places and the right situations, and that's listening to your audience speak amongst themselves, listening to, you know, what your audience is not saying in comments, what they're not saying, and you know, when they're asking questions, you know what the elephant in the room is sometimes. Like if they're not talking about a specific topic, it's because they're struggling with it. And maybe that's the thing that you need to be helping them with.

48:41 Yep. And I think the key, the keyword here is your target audience in this case, right. It's going and observing other communities that are similar to to the one you're trying to build and pay attention to what conversations they're having or or in your what you were saying or not having. Absolutely. And the other thing that I'll, I'll just give this little hint, the comments section of your competitors is the best place to go. Yeah, go anywhere. Absolutely, 100%. And you know, there are, you know, one of the places I've learned that works well for me in, in this scenario that you're describing are those on Instagram, those, what do they call them Jonathan channels where we, we have our own. Broadcast channels.

49:26 Broadcast channels, yeah, where we can see what conversations are happening or what the what are fellow leaders are talking about that might be of interest to our own community that we're trying to build. What, what kind of conversations are the leaders of those communities or the other podcasters? What are they talking about That may apply to my community and bringing it there. Brian, good morning, welcome to the stage. Talk about community. Brian's been a long time community member of this very community. Good to have you here and a happy belated birthday. I know you celebrated your birthday yesterday and what do you want to add to the conversation?

50:06 Thank you so much, Mark. Yes, thank you to everyone who wished me a happy birthday yesterday. Well, first, I do miss being contributing to these conversations on a consistent basis. I've had to work on getting my time back in the morning before I go to work. But what I will also say is I think that sometimes it's always good to go back to your roots. Because I will say, as I've been reflecting, about two months ago I reconnected with someone who I first met six years ago in 2019, and this was a charity walk that we were doing at a local mall.

50:52 And now this particular person occasionally will leave a comment on my live videos on my YouTube channel. So sometimes it just takes making that one good connection. And then in the case of LinkedIn, because I expanded my show to LinkedIn, I don't always get comments on there, but I do see that people, our viewing it is getting to people's feeds on there. So like after I record, it's a blessing. So sometimes it's not always spoken words from people, but that people are coming and checking it out. So absolutely, yeah.

51:37 So that's that's what I say about audience or community. I think it's generally community coming and checking it out. So thank you so much. You're welcome, Brian, and thank you for sharing that. And I think a great point to what you're saying is, again, when we talked about reaching out and connecting with our community or future community when it comes to something like LinkedIn, if you see people, and I'm not saying this to you specifically, Brian, I'm saying this to anybody, whether it's LinkedIn, Facebook, or what have you. If you see people are liking your posts, maybe they're not commenting, but maybe they're liking the the posts that you're making about your podcast or about your topic of interest re. I like to reach out to them sometimes. Hey, thank you.

52:20 I noticed that you've been quote UN quote liking my post and I appreciate it. Thank you. It means a lot. It it means that it shows me that people are seeing what I'm putting out there and connecting with it. Thank you. And that and that alone can make all the difference. Then they they may reply back. You're welcome. I really liked how you talked about this in particular. That really hit home with me. Now you've got an A conversation going and then you can go back to them. You know, Brian was pointing out it's been years since one of the people that he connected with, you know, it's been a while and he reached back out and that that did something for him and for what he's trying to build. And I think this applies here too. If somebody's just, if they're taking the time to hit the like button and you've started noticing that they have liked other posts too, or maybe it's the first time they've liked it, reach out and thank them and maybe ask them a question. Maybe.

53:17 And, and again, try to make it an either or, you know, instead of saying, what did you like about this? Did you like this or do you prefer that? Right? Make it a little more specific for them to make it easier for them to respond to you. We could go on and on and on. And we're running. We've run out of time. I want to in the near future, I'm going to bring on a guest who builds communities for I guess bet, for lack of better word, for a living. I want to bring them in so we can go even deeper on this conversation. So stay tuned for that. A little programming note for you tomorrow the show will be off. I am going to be watching my stepdaughter graduate college getting her nursing degree, so I didn't want to ask after two weeks of this community holding down the Fort, didn't want to ask everybody to do it again tomorrow. So enjoy the day off everybody.

54:15 As for the podcast, I'm looking to put out an episode from one of my old Minvo pro cast days and one of my old episodes from there. So stay tuned for that. But we will be back live Wednesday and then we'll put out that podcast episode on Wednesday as well, talking and covering all the headlines around the world of podcasting. And we will be probably back to normal for the rest of the week. There may be a travel day in there as I head back to North Carolina. I'll keep you posted. So no show Tuesday. We're back Wednesday, 7:00 AM Eastern. Looking forward to seeing you then. And until then, make it a great day. Everybody, take care.