510. Stop Telling People to Check Out Your Podcast

0:05 Marc Ronick: Good morning Today is Tuesday May the fifth, 2026 and today we're designing your podcast for someone discovering you for the very first time. What should they hear? Click, watch or understand before deciding to stick around and become a regular listener. So if you're listening live on clubhouse, hit the share button top right hand side of the screen and share it And if you're catching us via share this episode with a fellow And now give us about 30 seconds, we'll get things rolling. Thanks for being here.

0:51 The podcasting morning chat is podcasters launch polish and creators. Accountant helping creators build real business behind their content. Good morning again, podcasting, morning chat. Thank you so much for being here. I am your host, Mark ronick and currently on stage with me, as I am frantically inviting people on clubhouse to come join us.

1:32 My co hosts, Ralph Estep, DR Fay, Sid meadows, Alex Ballish and BC babbles .BC, Ralph and Dr are all on the video stream. If you want to catch us there, just go to podcasting morning show.com/join. Us. And I was just pausing because I was thinking, Did I say good morning again? Podcasting morning chat when I opened up the show? I think I did. I'm so used to saying that. Oh, well, c'est la vie. And welcome to Gabe and rich in the clubhouse. Audience. I want to say bright and early, but 8am doesn't feel like bright and early anymore. I know I used to say that at the 7am hour, it feels a little different.

2:14 But before we go any further, I want to first remind you about our Spotlight series that we're introducing to our community. If you'd like your podcast to be featured on the podcasting 62nd clip about your show, real feel for your podcast. If we select it, we'll play your clip on a future episode. We'll share what stood out to us, and we'll introduce your show to a community of podcasters and creators. So just go submit your clip now at podcasting morning show.com/spotlight and again, I'm encouraging that you please as the host, you introduce us to from a random episode, because I think that might do you justice a little bit more in this context, the way that we're sharing your podcast with our community.

3:11 So do that again. That's podcasting morning show.com/spotlight it is of no cost to you to do this is just a service we want to provide to our community, to put you in the spotlight, to get the word out there, to maybe get you a few listeners in the process. Okay, so speaking of new listeners in the process, today, we're talking about something that might be quietly costing you new listeners. A lot of podcasters are working really hard to get discovered. They're sharing the clips, they're posting the episodes, they're asking people to check out the show and trying to get in front of new audiences. But discovery really is only part of the job, because once someone finds you, they still have to make a decision, where do they start? Do they listen to the newest episode, the first episode, the trailer, the episode with the guest that they recognize, the one with the title that sounds interesting. And if that answer isn't obvious, a lot of people won't dig around.

4:14 They'll just move on. So today's conversation is about your podcasts, entry point, the doorway into your show, if you will, the obvious first step that gives someone who's brand new to you that signal that, yes, this is the one. Because your podcast may have great episodes, it might have some great conversations, it might have real value inside But if you're a new listener and you don't know where to begin. You may they may never hear the episode that would have made them care. So let's dig in with my first question today. podcast, what do you usually do next?

4:54 So put on your listener hat, not your podcaster hat, for a minute. When. Someone says, check out my podcast. What do you usually do next? If they've convinced you enough to go check out the podcast? Yes, BC, did you have something, or did you put your hand up and then change BC Babbles: I pivoted a second, because my initial thought was, well, first I'm going to reflect on whether or not in the moment, am I already enjoying the caught my attention, which you I'm like, Oh crap, that's my next step. I'm not sure what the next step after that is, but I would say, if I'm enjoying the show, if I like it, then I probably would go just real quick, see if they got a website or however they're kind of housing it, and try to peruse from there.

5:39 Marc Ronick: Okay, fair enough. And I think, BC you've just demonstrated, one of the reasons think a lot of people think, Okay, now, what Right? Like they go to the podcast. Now, what right? And your hesitation, I think, kind of proves that we don't have a natural instinct to us their podcast. So Sid, I saw you had something, and then I see Alex did as well. And by the way, a good morning to Junaid, bez and Dave. I've already said hello to Gabe and Rich, who have joined us here on clubhouse this Thank you for being here. And hello to Tim, who just walked in as well, walked into the virtual room, if you will. Sid, what did you want to answer to that question.

6:21 When someone says, check out my podcast. What do you usually do next? Sid Meadows: So if they haven't already, they tell me that they have a podcast that my first question is, hey, tell me about your podcast. What's it about? Like, I'm gonna learn about it, right? And if I'm interested in it, I'll do one or two things. I have a note in my notes app that says podcasts, and I will go to Apple, and I will grab the link for their podcast, and I will put it in my notes app. That's just a way for me to remember to go check this out. I might add a couple of notes about why or who the person is, how I met them, or I'll go into Apple and I'll open the I'll actually go to their podcast, and I'll open, I'll play for a couple of seconds, and then stop it, because then it shows in my bar to that I need to finish listening to it, and it'll stay there, and it will remind me to go back and listen to it.

7:08 So I take action to either copy the link or start the list, and so I can go back and listen to it later. Marc Ronick: All right, cool. So let me keep it going. I'll have some follow up questions here in a minute. Alex, I think you wanted to chime in. What do you usually do next? When someone says, check out my podcast, Alex Ballish: tell them to go to your best episode that you think is your best episode for my daughter's That's the award winning one And then go from there on the other side for my the one that I used to do for a show that's a little bit more difficult, because it's more of an accompaniment to the show that we're reviewing, so they can kind of pick it up. What I tell people is, we've done a re watch.

7:49 So if you want to, you know, start with episode one. That's fine, but you want to go episode by episode, we've done a re watch again, the average say, or the people that aren't into podcasting, they want a would if it was an Amazon Oh, I got this new thing. I got this maybe I'm overthinking it or not overthinking it enough, but, you know, put your best foot forward. That's all. Whatever your best podcast is, and it's probably not number one. Most number one episodes are probably one of the worst podcasts, I think for a lot of people, because they're still trying to get their groove.

8:32 But find a collection that you are proud of and recommend that don't make them try to find it. We're it's not, I know we're all about this, you know, figure it out yourself. No, people don't want that. They don't have time. Just give them what they want to Marc Ronick: hear. Yeah, Alex Ballish: instead of screwing around, trying to be all creative, don't be creative. Cuts it up. Chase. Marc Ronick: All right. So Alex says, send your best episode. Put your best foot forward. Alex Ballish: Or you're, you Say, what if you will really want to understand the podcast. Listen to this one, and maybe this one. You'll give them some choices that way. Marc Ronick: Okay, that's fair.

9:12 So, and Gabe in the chat says, my first episode was with Junaid. Hope it wasn't garbage. Well, Alex Ballish: you know what? You know, if you have Janae, then of course it's going to be good, but for the rest of us, Marc Ronick: that's right, that's right. Well, let's go to Junaid, who's on stage, and then we're going to hear from Ralph next Junaid, good morning. What do you want to add to all this? Junaid: Good morning? And Gabe, I want to point out to Gabe, is Gabe that was not your first podcast, either. It might be your first episode, but not your first podcast. Just like Billy last yesterday shared about how when he launched his new podcast, he had already done two podcasts before with several episodes. So that's the other thing that you want to look into. What I usually get asked is, hey, what's your best episode that we should go.

10:00 Listen to or if somebody says, Hey, go check out my podcast. I was like, Hey, I would check if they have a website, because I want to make sure that they have they taking control of their presence online, right? Having a website lets you do that, because if the podcast platform pulls and you want to send people to one place, so then they have the choice to say or not, the choice they have the direct access to be able to listen to the episode, not worrying about, oh, is it on Apple podcast? Is on YouTube? Is it on Spotify those then, you Okay, now you gotta remember to look into it. So having a website is something that I will always check if they have a podcast for their podcast.

10:43 Thanks, Marc Ronick: awesome. Yeah, you're welcome. And I think that Junaid, part of that might be because you are a podcast professional. You do this, you help podcasters in different ways, and you know that having the website and going to check the website is a thing that we do because we want to make sure the podcaster is properly set up for success, right? So I'm gonna go to Ralph, and then I have a follow up question I want to go to Sid with. So stand by Sid and Ralph. Good morning. What did you want to add to all this? Ralph Estep Jr: Good morning, everybody. I feel like we skipped a step here. Marc Ronick: Okay? Ralph Estep Jr: Because I feel misunderstood the question. But the question to me is, how do I get somebody to have interest in my podcast?

11:24 Marc Ronick: No, that was not Ralph Estep Jr: Okay. Then I apologize, because my whole thought was, if we want somebody to go find us, we got to sell them on the benefits of it. And that's what I put in the start off with an intention of, how do we get them interested? I don't I think you're going to hit a lot of friction if you say, well, go check out my Who cares? But if you give them a reason, I'll give you a great example of this my daily show. I talk about it all the time. We might be out at a restaurant or something like this, and the waitress will come up and I'll say, Hey, do you listen to podcasts? And she'll say, oh, yeah, listen to podcasts. I said, Do you ever struggle with money? Does money ever become an issue for you? She goes, yeah, all the time. I said, I talk about just that on my podcast every single day, nine times out of 10, they'll say to me, what is your website?

12:06 How do I get your podcast? Because I changed the dynamic a little bit. I flipped it and I said, I want them to need my podcast. I want them to want my podcast. Where I send them to me is a secondary piece to getting them. You know, have this voracious diet for it in the first place. Marc Ronick: I like that, yeah, and I like that strategy, Ralph, especially, because I think it's a safer bet to approach somebody who serves at a restaurant, because a lot of times those people are struggling a bit with money, or at least on a very strict budget. Because let's face it, servers don't always make the best money depending on the restaurant that they work for. So yeah, that's a good move Ralph Estep Jr: well. And the whole point is, I always say go to where your audience is. So if you're trying to build your show, go figure out where your audience is and provide them with something that would Marc Ronick: Absolutely. Yeah, and shout out to junior and Yvonne in the audience right Appreciate you guys both being here this morning on clubhouse Sid. I said I was going to come to you. I appreciated your answer in my follow up to that question next when you discover that new show, when you have gotten enough information to want to go Do you usually listen to the newest episode, the trailer, the most popular or whatever catches your eye?

13:29 Sid Meadows: That is a really I typically will scroll through it and look to see if there's an episode title that catches my eye, and then I will listen to that. I don't go all the way to the trailer, depending how long they've been podcasting. I don't go all the way back to the first episode. If I'm going to listen to one, the last five or 10 episodes. far. I'm not going to hit the See More button unless it's a topic I'm really, really interested in, right? So I'm going to look in like the first five or 10, and hopefully there's a title there that catches my attention, and I'll click play. Marc Ronick: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense, and that's a great call. Back to Last Tuesday's episode when we talked about episode titles and how valuable those can be. SID is going through the catalog, once he's been encouraged to go check it out, and he's scrolling through to find what title is catching my eye, I think that's Sid Meadows: well into Alex's point.

14:20 I'm not going to do a lot of work, right? I'm not going to put forth a lot of effort. I've grabbed your show information, I've clicked the link, and I'm going to look quickly, is there something that catches me? And I'm going to if there is, I'm going to click play. If it doesn't, I'll come back to it later. But I'm just not going to do a lot of heavy lifting to listen to a show that may not be relevant to me. Marc Ronick: Yeah, all right, that makes a lot of sense. And if anybody else wants to answer the question, you're more than welcome to if you have a different answer than title searching as far as that entry point for you, yeah, go ahead. BC, BC Babbles: and I'm just, I do apologize. I don't know if anyone mentioned this yet. If I've enjoyed the show and they and they say, you know, check out the podcast. What I might all. Also do is check out, you know, their socials. What Clips can I find?

15:04 What kind of viral moments can really kind of lure me in further into the show? off to me without me having to help me get a better idea of the Marc Ronick: Yeah, I like that And I think it's, yeah, I'm just thinking about these entry points, different things. Look every podcast does have a front door, whether the Creator designs it intentionally or not. Right? For some shows, it's the latest episode. For others, it's the trailer or the website or to BCS point. Maybe it's the social media page or a YouTube page. Maybe it's a pinned episode, or a playlist, a clip guest episodes. It could be a lot of things, even a recommendation from a friend.

15:48 And I think that's actually the big one to think about here when Is like, sure, if you're actually, if you have the opportunity to speak to a convince you to go listen to But a lot of times we get recommendations from friends, and those friends might just say, Hey, have you heard this podcast yet? Like, you got to go check this out. I listen to this show every week, and I can't get enough of it, but they might not tell you about a specific episode, or just say, Ah, it doesn't matter. Just go listen to one, right? So the podcaster, I think it's to make sure we do have an people that are being introduced And I think the problem here is that many podcasters haven't decided what their front door is.

16:42 I was gonna start with a question here for this segment, but Dr has her hand up, so I wanted to just check in. Dr, did you want to add something? D.R. Fay: Yeah, you started out this question by saying, Okay, leave the fact that you are a podcast professional aside. Yeah. And answer this question to be frank with you, I don't think I can leave that Marc Ronick: I hear you. D.R. Fay: I mean, the only reason why I am in podcasting is because several years ago, I started listening to podcasts with a different ear. I started asking questions like, why is the host still asking that question the guest has answered that already? Why are they marketing this that way?

17:23 This is insane marketing. Why I kept asking all of these questions, and I realized, you know, I think this is a producer's ear that I'm kind of leaning back on, and it's not like your regular Joe Schmo ear. You know, I Marc Ronick: hear you. I have a very hard time listening just as a listener, you know, even down to just critiquing. If it's a bad edit, I hear a bad edit or something bad D.R. Fay: edit, bad sound, everything. Marc Ronick: Yeah, yeah, I can't Fay: Yeah. Marc Ronick: Ralph, did you want interesting that you said that, because my wife is somebody that were going to the grocery store the other day, and we started talking about, she's she's learning about podcasting.

18:07 And I said, you're a great person to talk to. I said, let me ask you a couple questions. I said, What makes you want to listen to a podcast? And she says, Well, if it's a topic that I'm interested in, I'm like, okay, good. Because I think all of us in the don't see the outside. And then I said to her, I said, Well, how do you find that? She goes, Well, I go to chat GPT, and if I've got a the best podcast to listen to on I said, Oh, that's interesting as well. And I said, so what you're really focusing on the title? She goes, oh yeah. listening to Joe Rogan. Most of his stuff is garbage, but if I see somebody I'm interested in, I'll go and click on it and listen to it. And I just thought, Wow, what a wealth of knowledge from somebody that doesn't is not involved in the podcasting sphere.

18:53 And I said, Okay, well, what else do you do? She goes, Well, I like Spotify, and I like this. And I was like, this was so enlightening to me, because it was somebody that doesn't do it every day. And so my takeaway from that is, I think we need to spend a lot more time talking to our audience and asking them, what do they want from us? What is the entry door they want from us? Do they want a nice front porch? Do they want a nice trailer? Do they want all these other things, because I think that. But, like, I thought that was really eye opening. I think we all can learn from those things. Marc Ronick: Yeah, thank you, Ralph. And in a moment, I'm going to ask all of you, what do you think is currently the front door to your podcast? All right, so start thinking about that. What do you think the front door currently not podcasting, but you're a part of this show.

19:44 You can use this show instead. Okay, so, but before I do, Alex, I saw you wanted to add something, so Alex Ballish: just go on. Just go on. Marc Ronick: Sure. Okay, all right, no problem. So, yeah, so let's go to you, Ralph, since we were just talking to you, what do you think is currently the front door to your podcast and share with. One we're talking about, since I know you have a couple. Ralph Estep Jr: Yeah, I think I use my daily financially confident Christian my front that's really useful to me, fact, I just redid it and I yesterday, but it's the same website, that I use on my YouTube, and when you land on my see that same thing there.

20:26 say, Oh yeah, I've got to listen talking directly to me. That's my that's my thing. I want them to say, Hey, this is a guy that understands me. This is just like I talked about at the restaurant. I'm doing the same thing with the front door. I want them to be so ravenous for my content that they go I got to listen to 10 episodes, and that works. I'll tell you what, because I can look at my statistics, and I have almost the same number of listeners every day, but my download numbers are increasing. So what that tells me is more people are getting more episodes. So that idea is starting to grow more. door. It's my trailer of, here's what's in it for you, not necessarily, oh, here's my best episode. It's, here's what's in it for you, which kind of ties into what we talked about yesterday.

21:10 I have a business mentality of, I am trying to drive something here, and that's porch. Marc Ronick: Thank you, Ralph. And I'm loving these analogies, front door, front porches, etc. BC, did you want to chime in? What do you think is currently the front door to your podcast? BC Babbles: Yeah, and I'll use a that show, which I try to make sure is evident in every kind of the episodes, is that I'm talking about someone's boss the way they wish they could talk about their boss on a public platform like I'm not employed by them, so I don't care. I'm going to talk about how their behavior sucks this way or that way, or how the conditions don't work for the employee for this reason or that reason.

21:54 So I think that relatability of helping ideally with the show, helping employees who are dealing with certain environments find a venting space to have someone who kind of sees where they are and who relates to it and tries to give them advice on how to navigate it is the open door, which is the just the whole premise of the show. Marc Ronick: Yeah, I like that, and I like the premise of your show, by the way, as well, you Do people send in stories about their bosses, and then you respond to those. BC Babbles: I do make the the CTA, like, submit your story. It's always anonymous. I don't you know, unless you want the glory publicized.

22:37 You know, I'm like, it's always anonymous. I don't have that yet. I am encouraging people to do so. I pull a lot of the stories that I get from Reddit for the moment, but CTA caffeination nation, if you want me to talk about your boss, submit your story now. All right. Awesome. We will do that. D.R. Fay: I've always wanted to do a podcast. It would be strictly a hobby podcast, but on customer service, and because I've had a lot of years in customer service, and there are some brutal stories from, you know, the customers that you deal with, but also your co workers that are so messed up. So I think it would be a very entertaining podcast. Marc Ronick: I think so too.

23:22 I agree. All right, I know that. Sid wanted to respond as well. Sid Meadows: The question was, podcast? Marc Ronick: Correct? Sid Meadows: And to me, that's Sid, meadows.com/podcast, everything you want to know about the podcast is there. Every episode is listed there. You can see the headshot, the number, the title, you can click on it. I mean, everything about me relative to podcast is on that landing page. And I share that landing page a lot. And if you Googled me, that's probably one of the first things that's actually going to come up. So to me, it's my website. I'm not going to send you fishing on Apple or Spotify, and not an i or whatever, right?

24:03 I'm just gonna send you to my website where everything is and hopefully, while you're there, you click the link to join our community and you become part of our email list. Marc Ronick: Okay, I love that somebody who clearly has the door. I love that. Thank you very much for that, Sid. And by the way, we have somebody here on YouTube who will actually be a guest on this show coming up soon. I'll let Ralph explain that in a second. She says, good stuff, guys, I love the idea of asking non podcast listeners for their insights. That feels more important as podcasting continues to get more and more mainstream. And yeah, Ralph, who is this mystery person? Ralph Estep Jr: Yeah, this is my Tuesday to talk about how using publicity.

24:52 And I love her thing PR shield, of how to keep you out of hot water when you run into those problems. So she's going to join us on Tuesday. Okay, so she's joined us here in the live show. So thank you for joining us, Cindy, and we're looking forward to our chat on Tuesday coming up. Marc Ronick: Thank you, Cindy, Did anybody else want to share what's their front door? And if not, I'll share mine. I think for this show, there are a couple of entry points, and I'm going to MIT admit that I don't know that I've leaned on any one of these intentionally, right? I know I set them up intentionally. So for example, if you first of all, I will always send people to my web website.

25:34 So I guess in some ways, that's the front door. If somebody wants to know more about my podcast, I say go to podcasting morning show.com right? But now they've come to the front door. What does the front door look like? And the first thing technically they see is the logo along with a description of the show. But if they scroll just a little bit further, this is where, what I consider one of the first entry points, and that's the our favorites section. And this is something that pod page provides as part of their podcast website services. And there's a link, by the way, my affiliate link in the show notes if you're interested in checking out pod page, but the our favorites section is great because there's literally a toggle switch within the back end of your pod page that you can select any episode as a favorite.

26:24 I think my mistake with using that section is I have too many episodes listed under our favorites. I believe that if somebody has they might go there and pick one But I think it's my job to make that a little easier, a little more digestible. So I think I need less episodes in that section. But nonetheless, there is that section there as a Getting Started point. From there, I also have, I would say our show trailer is definitely an entry point, especially for those who may have just gone straight to a our show trailer is our second lot, really, probably by like So our first, everybody knows, I say it all the time, our first most downloaded episode being our episode where we talked about Steve from Blue's Clues starting his podcast, which he's been doing now, I want to say for about a year, maybe almost a year. And I'd say lastly, I have this page that I don't talk about enough, and that maybe needs to be revamped a little bit.

27:36 But in our toolbar at have a Grow Your show page. This was a page that I used originally as a landing page for the show last year. I need to revamp it, and I need to talk about it, because what that page does is it provides three episodes that I hand selected that I felt like could really help somebody take those next steps to actually growing their audience. And it starts with a welcome video of me introducing the person, the new listener for the first time, introducing them to our family, introducing them to the website and our show, and then telling them about the three episodes that I've provided for them to get started with. So I might change that page from grow the show to get started or something like that, and start promoting it more.

28:29 But I hope that these have given some of you some ideas, maybe, if you're not thinking about entry points, that gives you some ideas of maybe where you'd want to start or improve what you're doing. Ralph Estep Jr: in? Yeah and Mark, maybe we need to change the homepage for the podcasting Morning Show and make it center a welcome video. Maybe that's what we need to do, because I could just see how inviting that would be if I went to the podcasting morning show. Up, Pops. Mark, hey. Thank you for joining us. Let me tell you about what we do here on the morning show. I think that would be an excellent entry point mark. So that might be something to think about. And if you're a podcast, I mean, that's what I'm doing on my shows. Every one of my shows, I follow that same course. Because if somebody's new to me, I want to introduce them, because a lot of what we do is relationship based.

29:14 And if we can start to build that relationship right away, because if somebody just clicks on one of your episodes, they don't have any background. They don't understand. Why is Sid talking is? Why is Dr talking is, why is BC talking that that can be kind of off putting a little bit, because you don't know who these the middle of the show and you're like, what's going on? If you have some way to on ramp them and sort of introduce them to the content. I just think that'd be a great idea. And then, Mark, I love what you're saying. Then you say, Okay, here's if you're really getting started, here's the first three things you should listen to. And maybe we build something out, sort of along the lines of, this is how the show works. Here's how the community functions. Here's how we want to get you involved in this.

29:54 Oh, and by the way, if you're new to podcasting, here's what I can do to help you out, because then we're thinking about that business. Piece at the front end as well. Marc Ronick: Thank you, Ralph, And Jody Kringle in the YouTube chat says, careful with the stuff that auto plays. Totally agree with you, Jody, it where I had that same problem. Mark, and I moved away from posting it on YouTube, and I use a product called voomly. And with voomly, I can create my own playlists, because that's the problem with YouTube, is once you put one thing up there, then it automatically goes into this, you know, array of different things. That's one of the benefits. And there's other products that do it. But I love voomly, because then I can put a playlist of just what I want them to hear in that order.

30:38 So that's something if you're a podcast or a content creator, and YouTube's free, I get it, but this gives you the ability to really control the narrative. So that, to me, is just more beneficial. Marc Ronick: I hear that, and I know there are some ways to go into certain YouTube videos and change that auto play setting, because mine doesn't auto play when you land on that. Grow your show page at podcasting, morning show.com but I don't know. With playlists, I don't play with them enough to know if you can turn on or off the auto play. But I'm almost certain you could turn that off if you wanted to. Ralph Estep Jr: Yeah, I do that with voom Lee on mine. Like I have a little button you have to push play. And that's a decision point that you can make, because that is frustrating if every time you go to somebody's website started, hey, welcome. It's like, whoa.

31:23 Stop dude, calm down a little bit. Yeah. Good. Good point. Jody, Marc Ronick: yep. And Jody says what she really means is auto playing when someone arrives on the site, not what comes after. Yeah, that's the way I was Jody, thank you appreciate it. Did anyone else want to chime in? I'm trying to look here. Junaid, did you want to chime in? Junaid: Yeah, absolutely. So. Excellent points on the different entry points on how people are introduced to and Ralph, I'm going to implement the same thing for my hacks and hobbies podcast, because right now it's just a page. Here's the future episodes, and people get to self select. But I like the idea of actually guiding them through that journey, listener journey, something that I love.

32:06 multiple landing pages for ICPs? I guess you could say there's a there's an ICP or a landing page for a musician. How can a musician use kit.com which is an email marketing service. that page is also geared music, blah, blah. So when you're mentioning mark, the featured page that you have of the podcast, if you can have different categories that were that people can go deeper into, just like on Apple podcasts or Spotify, you can say, hey, I don't know what I want to listen to, but I want I'm listening. I want to I'm interested in the education category, or I'm interested into entrepreneurship and go down that path of, hey, I want to listen to how can I grow my show, or how can I keep listeners on my podcast?

33:03 How can I bring in guests on my show? So this could be different episodes specific to that You know what I'm saying? Something like Marc Ronick: that. Yep, absolutely. And that's something I take advantage of as well. With pod page, you can categorize your episodes, and you can actually even put them into multiple categories. And I do that religiously. I think it's really important, because when my listeners are coming, when our listeners are coming to the website, they can, if they want, they could actually just search by category. So if they're looking for monetization and business development, they'll go to that category on the website, and then they'll probably find a lot of money Monday episodes, even though we do have a Money Monday category as well, right?

33:53 But there could be stuff. If they're looking to improve their guest interviews, they might look for guest interview and insights as far as that section, that category on our page, etc, yeah. So I think it's important to if you have that ability, yeah, create those categories. Yvonne's been on stage waiting patiently. Good morning to you. Yvonne, did you want to add anything Yvonne: good morning? Well, I just want to say I think you can have multiple entry points to your podcast. I have a welcome video on YouTube. I have a trailer. Of course, my website is definitely an entry point, and I have favorite episodes that are on the podcast page, down at the bottom, I put a book could be an entry way to my the book, I mentioned that I I consider that an entry point Marc Ronick: Yeah, absolutely.

34:59 Yvonne, if you. Had to tell somebody one entry point for your podcast, specifically, what would it be? Yvonne: I'd send them to my Ronick: yeah, Yvonne: yeah, Marc Ronick: yeah, me, too. Me too. And I gotta say, calling back to what Ralph was saying. video on the homepage. I don't know why I hesitate about that. I can't Yvonne: I have a video on the homepage as well for for so I have a welcome video on YouTube, a welcome video on my website, and the trailer, which needs updating. Marc Ronick: Are they all the same? Yvonne: No, Marc Ronick: okay, so they're unique to their platform. Yvonne: Yeah, it's just like I more recently, and specifically thinking about how I wanted to welcome people on YouTube, I look at my welcome video on the website, because it's been there for a while, and see how that's landing at this point.

35:51 Because I feel like I'm making I feel like I'm morphing, we'll say so I may need to make some updates. Marc Ronick: Yes, yes. And I think that there's something valuable about creating a unique video on those different platforms. I think it's showing a, that you're making an effort, and B, you're catering to that kind of audience, right? Like you could, theoretically, you could be making a YouTube video specific for a YouTube audience, and a website video specific to your website audience, and yeah, you're going to say very different things if you're doing it that way, right? If you're coming to my website and you see my welcome video, I'm going to probably tell you a little bit about the website itself, right, like where you can find things, how you can get started, etc, that's going to look different than if I'm making a specific trailer or entry point video on a platform like YouTube. Ralph Estep Jr: Now, Mark, you mentioned you were hesitant to that.

36:44 Let's talk about yeah for a second. So what is your hesitation? Because I don't take this the wrong way, but I don't get Marc Ronick: it, yeah? Well, I don't know that I get it either. I think maybe I am just tied to what a traditional website page would look like when you land on It's just, it's, it's just like it took me a very long time to move away from long, long intros on my podcast, right? Like, with lots of music and fanfare and a professional voiceover person and like that, took me a long time to move away from it, because I felt like that's just how you do a show, right? But times change and audiences change, and you got to cater to it.

37:25 And I think that could be the case here for the website as well. Just having some kind of welcome video, I get it. It makes total sense. I think it's just, it's just one of those locked in neural pathways in my brain that I got to just kind of clean over and start a new one. suggest a book for everybody. There's a book called sacred cows make the best burgers. And if you're in business or thinking about dabbling in business, go read that book. Because so many of us get stuck in this routine of, well, this is the way we have to do it. And I think Mark, that's a little bit of what you're feeling right there. And when I've worked with other organizations, and we've read the book as sort of a group building exercise, it's amazing how many things you think about, always done it.

38:10 way to do it. So just that that book is one of the ones that I have. A few books that I believe in. Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Influence People. But those two books I've got that one specifically, you know, It is one you won't want to put down. Marc Ronick: Love that. Thank you, Ralph, appreciate that. By the way, I failed to let you all know that we have a an evaluation coming up this Thursday. So if you want honest, helpful feedback on your podcast, every other Thursday ish, we review a real show from our community with the goal of helping that podcaster grow and helping everyone listening learn from it. This week, we're evaluating the loud quiet, a podcast about empty nest living, hosted by Rick and Clancy Denton. They are former clients of mine and current friends as well, and I'm looking forward to Thursday, May the seventh. Ralph Estep Jr: I just got a laugh about what Dr, put into the private chat.

39:13 She says, Great, now I'm hungry for Burger, so I'm looking out my window here, and I got cows out here in the pasture next to me. beef Right, right out the what you're saying. Marc Ronick: I had a burger just So Nan and to you. Dr, yeah, all right. BC, you wanted to add something as well, BC Babbles: yeah. And I was gonna say to your pause about putting a video intro trailer on your website, and I get it. We're far past the days of website and music automatically plays. But one thing I did myself, that I found I kind of had the same effect without the noise, is instead create a silent kind of hodgepodge of action moments from the show I created.

40:00 This great little reel of just my reaction to my guests and how and their more energetic moments, completely silent, no sound whatsoever. But I found that it still brought a lot of traffic to the website and a lot of exploration without having to element. So that could be an alternate for you, if the concern is more audio based and somewhat intrusive audio based, if you get what I'm saying, Marc Ronick: I do and Jody puts in the Oh no, that was not Jody. That was Ralph. Did you say MySpace? I BC Babbles: didn't say MySpace. And I had the best music choices for anyone who did visit my MySpace back in the day. I'll just say that right Marc Ronick: now. Is that ever coming back D.R.

40:43 Fay: past? Feeling the past? Marc Ronick: It is I feel like There's somebody trying to make an effort to bring MySpace back. Yeah, I don't know. Jody in the chat did say I have a video on my voice over website, actually, but people do kind of have to look for it. It's lower on the page, yeah. Well, if you're going to do that, I would say Jody, put that up toward the top. Why not? BC Babbles: Mine's in the hero section, Marc Ronick: yeah, yeah. Why not? I'm definitely going to consider using that all right. Let's see. We have 15 minutes. I want to try a little exercise with everybody. If anybody is interested a little live exercise for the room. So if I were brand new to your podcast, what episode, and I'm making that distinction very clear, what episode should I start with, and why?

41:36 Where would you send me to a specific episode? Anyone have any thoughts, or is the silence Ralph Estep Jr: an indication So Mark, I think that's a great thing to think about, because I think all of us need to build an intentional first episode. I think it's, I don't think it's a good idea to say, well, go to this one, because I think you need to have some the end in mind for that. So maybe you have an entry point episode that that is sort of evergreen, but maybe needs to be updated frequently. You know, I'll give you a great example that my morning show. I just launched a thing called faithful fundamentals, which is using that the words, the letters and faithful to define how to answer a particular question. So what I'm doing right now with my team is we're actually building that quote first episode to send somebody to so they understand how Ralph So to answer your question directly, I think you have to be intentional about that and build that first episode with the end in mind of what you want your listeners to do and how they connect to the show, what the value is for them.

42:34 I think if you just send them to I'll go listen to my latest one. Again, if they don't have context and they don't you do. I'm not sure that's going to be terribly effective. Marc Ronick: So Ralph, do you have a first episode that you would send people to? Ralph Estep Jr: I'm working on I've kind of changed the way I'm Now I will tell you what the content creators accountant I actually send them to the first episode, because I built that with the intention of, hey, if you're new to this, here's who I am, here's what I do, here's what I promise to give you. Now I've morphed a little bit, and I've probably improved my performance side of that so, but all that said, I think it's still valuable. So I in that particular case, that one is the go to one, it's the first one, so you understand.

43:17 feel like build off one of after So in that case, that particular show works really well. Marc Ronick: Thank you. Ralph and Sid wanted to chime in, and then so did BC, go ahead. Sid. Sid Meadows: So depending on who whatever, depending on who they are, will depend on where I send company, I'm going to send them to one of my favorite CEO chats. If they're a dealer and own a dealership, I'm going to send them to one of my favorite dealer owner podcasts, right? If they're an interior designer, I may send them to a one of the episodes about product development and how products are developed. So if I know who they are, I'm going to pick a episode to tell them where to start, so that it the message in that episode will resonate with them, when they start listening, to show. Marc Ronick: I love that answer.

44:07 Sid, I think that is quite intentional, right? It's really picking it based on who's asking sharing a show that makes sense. And again, that's where I think categorizing your episodes is going to come in handy for you, because I don't believe that a lot of us off the top of our head, because based on some of the silence when I asked the question, I think if we don't our head, we got to think We only have a few minutes, possibly to convince somebody to listen, or at least to send somebody to the right episode to listen to. So yeah, I strongly urge people to think along those same lines as Sid and yeah, have have certain types of episodes on the ready based on the people you're interacting with, all right?

44:52 BC you're up, my friend, go for it. BC Babbles: So if I was going to caffeination nation, I would direct them to Episode 34 War, and that's for a couple of reasons. For context, that episode discusses revoking resignations, mediation with narcissists and job interview scams. One, because it's one of my more heated episodes, but again, it's one of those great, you know, just talking realistically about situations like I mentioned, but also because that is, and I mentioned this a while ago, when talking about my show, is that it's one episode off of which there is a caffeinated take, which is my content, where I go on kind of a response on a particular topic. So I would direct them to that episode one, because they're they've been through job scams narcissistic boss, or if they resignation too early and then whatever reason. But also because I go into a more structured, more, I think, more relatable, emotionally charged rant, which is premium content.

46:02 So I think that would be that's a great opportunity to get them into the show. It gives them a more fully flushed out potential of what they can experience with the show. Lead them potentially to become an early paid subscriber, at least for an episode, to check it out. Caveat for it as well. That's my reasoning for that episode. So episode 34 would be my my go to direction for any new listeners of the podcast. Ralph Estep Jr: BC I have a question for you, yes. So you use the word unhinged, and I want to hear that. Why when I go to listen to one of those? But you are intentional in putting that behind the paywall. I'm wanting to understand what your thought process is there. BC Babbles: My thought process there is that, wow, he Marc Ronick: wants to make money.

46:49 BC Babbles: My thought process episode of the show, I want to seriousness of any given actionable advice, like from my perspective, with my experience with the narcissistic boss, or to figure out this weird provide to the listener? And that's my kind of any given episode aim. But I also feel like there are, there's a capacity to be more emotionally based and to just really kind of want to vent about one of the many pitfalls I think our hiring system, our job pool system, has, whether or not it's job scams, whether or not it's going through personally, I've been through 10 rounds of the interview for a single company to be told, No, I didn't get the job, but without any kind of feedback. And I'm the kind of person who will, you know, despite all the time I've invested, I'll be like, thank you so much for the consideration.

47:48 I enjoyed talking to you. Is there any kind of feedback you can provide? Because I want to be more prepared for the future and get nothing in return. And you know, to have that moment of like, wow, I spent 10 interviews with you, and you can give me nothing back that lets me know, like what's going on. So providing that more kind of raw, relatable moment as a premium bit of content, I think, is a great way to kind of emotionally draw people in who are looking for that more unfiltered. I need someone to rage with me about how the system just doesn't work. Right now, Ralph Estep Jr: can I interject something real quick? Because my concern is, if I'm new to your show and the first interaction I have with you is go buy something, do you worry that that chases people off?

48:33 I'm not saying it's the wrong approach, because, you know, I love money, so I'm all about making money with your stuff. But I'm just wondering, before I get to know you well is that, is that a push that you worry about being too far a push right away? BC Babbles: No, and that's why it's not an immediate push in the episode. So I don't know. take until I get to the story. reading it in the moment and have already thought about, but if I find myself continuing to push and push and push and I I'll stop in that moment say, I think there'll be a cafe to take for this topic, so come back later, or at least subscribe for free to the channel to keep an eye out for it. But it's never an opening pitch, it's never an immediate CTA. It's in the moment when I feel that a particular story is triggering me a bit more in the emotional sex, so it's kind of an opportunistic thing, but it's Marc Ronick: Very cool. Thank you.

49:30 BC, thank you, Ralph for those questions. All right, before we wrap up, I want to go here for a second. A lot of podcast apps naturally push the latest episode, right? That means that the latest episode often becomes the default entry point, even if it wasn't designed for a new listener. And I think that puts a lot of pressure on one episode, or at least it could. So I'm curious, if you're feeling that pressure, how much pressure, and I'm asking this to all of you Ink. How much pressure are we putting on the latest episode to represent the whole show? And I'll throw in this, are we thinking about that when we're putting out and constructing the latest episode?

50:12 Do you feel like that's a lot of Anybody? Ralph Estep Jr: And Mark, one of actually allows you to pin a featured episode in his player. Marc Ronick: Yeah, Ralph Estep Jr: and I think that's really a great idea. I would like to see more of the apps do that, because I agree with you, I think there's a lot of pressure, because what if it's not so great this week, like you had an off day or or today's show just wasn't what you normally bring. It still provides value. But is it that go to thing? Because, like you've said, you might get one chance for somebody to click on that, hear the first five minutes, or the first two minutes of that and go, Ah, this clown's out of his mind. I'm not going to listen to this one again. Whereas, if you can pin a featured episode that you really more valuable mark. I think it's a very good point.

50:59 Marc Ronick: Thank you. And I am making a note here. We will put the link to true fans, the podcasting hosting platform, in the show notes. But that's also true fans. Dot F M and I know our true fans winner, who won a free year of subscription to true fans, Austin, is in the audience. Austin, if you want to put in the chat, I'm curious. Have you started yet? Have you taken advantage? Would love to hear that. D.R. Fay: And it's not only fans. Yes, true Marc Ronick: fans. True fans, not only fans. D.R. Fay: I always feel like I have to say that whenever I hear Marc Ronick: I'll tell you what.

51:40 I think this week, all of our matter, because we've only had this week we I think any one of the episodes we've had could be great entry points for a new I think that we've been having really strong conversations that could help a lot of podcasters. So I think, yeah, I think any of our episodes from last week and this week, if those are the ones that somebody landed on first, I'd be perfectly happy with that. Yeah, all right. So I think look, when we're talking about entry points and we're talking about, yeah, the front door, the front porch, etc, I think today's, I think we It's like our entry point is like a book cover, right?

52:25 We want to make sure that people are understanding right away that they're given something that they can take in and say, Yeah, this is a good show. This is a show that I need, that I want, right? So we got to make that easy for them. We don't want them to shuffle through dozens of episodes to try to find the right one. Send them to a place, whether it's a landing page specifically for new podcasters, or maybe you are hand selecting episodes, like Sid does, but we can't always hand select our episodes to people who might just discover us on their own, right? So we got to try to make it easy for them. I think even at the beginning of our shows, just a one line, hi to all of our new listeners. If you're new to this show, this might not be your best show to start with.

53:14 Here's where I think you should start. Just give them that and keep Like you don't have to harp on it. You don't have to take up a ton of time. But when you say that, hello, again, podcasting morning show, and I do my little intro, I could quickly just say and if podcasting morning show, go on podcasting morning show.com, and then keep going. But that, that one quick line could make a huge difference and convert somebody who's just stopping by into a regular listener. Great conversation today, everybody. And tomorrow, we're covering all the headlines around the world of podcasting, all the ones that we think you as an independent DIY podcaster would want to hear thoughts and opinions on so come podcasting morning And if you want to support the show, podcasting morning show.com/support, and you can contribution to this show if So until tomorrow, make it a great day.

54:23 Everybody. Take care. Ralph Estep Jr: Bye.